It's kicking off in London...
- Thread starter JohnH
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Nice ideal.JohnH":227odh3j said:
Unlikely, though - as manufacturing in anything worth a damn normally gets moved to where the workforce(s) are cheapest.
More principled posturing like the quote you made earlier in the thread for Dyson - true there may be some clever ideas coming from (effectively) entrepreneurs, but anything where there's real money to be made, usually gets sent off to be manufactured where the workforce is cheapest.
That boat has sailed.
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I'm a Mechanical Engineer working as an Applications/Project Engineer in a manufacturing company, this company makes a fortune! We make compressor valves, PTFE and PEEK piston/rider/rod rings for industrial size compressors and hyper compressors and export globally to OEM's and end users. There are plenty of opportunities for engineering companies in specialists sectors. The skills base is still here in the right parts of the country.
You said it there yourself, though - "in specialist sectors".Easy_Rider":rhr915il said:
Where there's lots of money to be made, and workforce costs a major factor, the work tends to get shipped to whatever region can do it cheapest. Of course there will be niche exceptions, but the generalism stands true - and by that I mean to a degree that has any notable impact on the nation's economy. Dyson is a prime example of that.
There must be some money in the design, development and marketing side of engineering (when accompanied by the necessary protection of trademarks and design innovations) because although Apple's iMacs, iPhones and iPads are manufactured in the far east, the company has an estimated $35 billion in the bank... :shock:
Similarly, ARM (what's left of the old Acorn Computers) makes bucket loads of cash by licensing out its microprocessor designs to mobile phone manufacturers -- but ARM has no manufacturing facility of its own. It just designs, patents and then licences its technology.
Similarly, ARM (what's left of the old Acorn Computers) makes bucket loads of cash by licensing out its microprocessor designs to mobile phone manufacturers -- but ARM has no manufacturing facility of its own. It just designs, patents and then licences its technology.
Neil, I went back and looked for that Dyson lecture, and here's the 'juicy' bits.... :shock:Neil":3lfdaaz0 said:
I wish I'd quoted that a few posts ago. :roll: I might have brought One Eyed Jim and Dbmtb around to my way of thinking....James Dyson":3lfdaaz0 said:
silverclaws
Senior Retro Guru
Just a question, what discipline did all those who have influenced society in a positive way pursue ?
What branch of study ?
What branch of study ?
That started off with Dyson lecturing that we need to get back to actually having manufacturing in this country (yes he talks about the importance of engineering, too - but he does stress how we need to get back to manufacturing - he uses the term "championing manufacturing") - given that he's shipped his (for sound business reasons, I might add) manufacturing abroad - it's fair comment to point out the hypocrisy.JohnH":tg2cgdj0 said:Neil, I went back and looked for that Dyson lecture, and here's the 'juicy' bits.... :shock:Neil":tg2cgdj0 said:
I wish I'd quoted that a few posts ago. :roll: I might have brought One Eyed Jim and Dbmtb around to my way of thinking....James Dyson":tg2cgdj0 said:
He does go on to talk about what that's meant for his business, and how many people are now employed at his sites in the UK. Thing to point out there, is that it's all about business growth and a burgeoning company - but the only way they could see that growth, was to take manufacturing elsewhere. That's telling us something already - 1) that he found the need 2) that it (moving manufacturing) was essential for his company to grow 3) growth was essential
Now I get the underlying theme that some are suggesting - that the way for our economy and workforce to thrive is to innovate - and I wouldn't necessarily argue against that - but we won't compete on the mass manufacturing stakes with the countries that currently (and that will likely change) provide cheap manufacturing.
Skill and innovation is one thing, mass manufacturing and cheap labour another.
I don't doubt that the UK can at times compete on engineering, design, innovation and maybe R&D - but workforce costs for sizable operations are rarely conducive to a profitable enterprise, unless the countries providing cheaper labour aren't tooled up to provide it - and if they're not currently equipped, it won't be long.
silverclaws
Senior Retro Guru
Dyson is a hypocrite he became that when he changed his views regarding employing British people to make this British Design and send the work overseas to benefit the god of profit and enhance another county's economy.
Here he put proud workers on the dole, another company that sold out to the far east and lumped the British tax payer with more people to pay for on benefits, which brings us back to the unemployed, for it is companies that create that problem.
But whilst manufacturing is being sent overseas, there will be no increase in work available for the unemployed, and the trend is there will be more unemployed to come. I heard last night a friend has just been made redundant, the company is relocating, guess where, India
I think perhaps Britain has had it regards manufacturing, we have had our heyday, now we have to move on to other things, the times of a mass employer has gone.
But what next, what will get this country going if it is not to be the past ?
This guy is pretty inspiring ;
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/michael_pritchard_invents_a_water_filter.html
as is this lady;
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/bonnie_bassler_on_how_bacteria_communicate.html
Both people show what we are good at is ideas, what made us great in the past when materials and labour was cheap, but as life has moved on labour and cheap materials have moved away from us, so we are stuck with ideas, the question is can we make ideas our industry or is it we are screwed before we start through lack of governmental interest
Here he put proud workers on the dole, another company that sold out to the far east and lumped the British tax payer with more people to pay for on benefits, which brings us back to the unemployed, for it is companies that create that problem.
But whilst manufacturing is being sent overseas, there will be no increase in work available for the unemployed, and the trend is there will be more unemployed to come. I heard last night a friend has just been made redundant, the company is relocating, guess where, India
I think perhaps Britain has had it regards manufacturing, we have had our heyday, now we have to move on to other things, the times of a mass employer has gone.
But what next, what will get this country going if it is not to be the past ?
This guy is pretty inspiring ;
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/michael_pritchard_invents_a_water_filter.html
as is this lady;
http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/bonnie_bassler_on_how_bacteria_communicate.html
Both people show what we are good at is ideas, what made us great in the past when materials and labour was cheap, but as life has moved on labour and cheap materials have moved away from us, so we are stuck with ideas, the question is can we make ideas our industry or is it we are screwed before we start through lack of governmental interest
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