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I very much doubt he will be quite as ebullient in there.
I very much doubt he will be quite as ebullient in there.
cyclist who knocked over and killed
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Silvergoat
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18 months too long and as a scapegoat. As tragic as it was that she died, Mrs Briggs was fatally injured because she simply stepped out into the road while concentrating on her mobile phone instead of looking out for traffic before stepping out to cross. Alliston has been unlucky in that she did this and then stepped back into his path, so he couldn't avoid her, irrespective of his bike or the arrogance of youth.
He's been even more unlucky because Mr Briggs who is wealthy, owns his own PR company in the City and is extremely very well connected, had the resources and the contacts to bring the case to the highest court in the land. The hapless Alliston who has been painted as another dangerous out of control cycling dick, had no resources or privileges or access to experts behind him for his defence.
The case and its outcome has been a boon for the anti-cycling lobby and has set a precedent which means all cyclists are going to be viewed as guilty in any similar incidents in the future. Already, the reporting of cyclists is increasingly negative and more letters being published in the press which use lazy sweeping generalisations that describe cyclists as a whole as lawless menaces that need to be legislated against.
There have been many cases where cyclists who have been knocked off their bikes and either injured or killed where the motorist or truck driver has got away with it as being an accident or that the cyclist involved in the collision was somehow at fault for being there on the road and under their truck.
18 months too long and as a scapegoat. As tragic as it was that she died, Mrs Briggs was fatally injured because she simply stepped out into the road while concentrating on her mobile phone instead of looking out for traffic before stepping out to cross. Alliston has been unlucky in that she did this and then stepped back into his path, so he couldn't avoid her, irrespective of his bike or the arrogance of youth.
He's been even more unlucky because Mr Briggs who is wealthy, owns his own PR company in the City and is extremely very well connected, had the resources and the contacts to bring the case to the highest court in the land. The hapless Alliston who has been painted as another dangerous out of control cycling dick, had no resources or privileges or access to experts behind him for his defence.
The case and its outcome has been a boon for the anti-cycling lobby and has set a precedent which means all cyclists are going to be viewed as guilty in any similar incidents in the future. Already, the reporting of cyclists is increasingly negative and more letters being published in the press which use lazy sweeping generalisations that describe cyclists as a whole as lawless menaces that need to be legislated against.
There have been many cases where cyclists who have been knocked off their bikes and either injured or killed where the motorist or truck driver has got away with it as being an accident or that the cyclist involved in the collision was somehow at fault for being there on the road and under their truck.
highlandsflyer
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He stood over a dying person, screaming abuse at them. He then repeated abuse at them via other means.
He will have a cushy repose at the pleasure of the state.
I agree there is a huge disparity in sentencing between different vehicle users, but let's not get away from the facts.
The man is remorseless, and bang to rights.
Let him rot in front of his PlayStation, and don't taint cyclists further by identifying with him.
He stood over a dying person, screaming abuse at them. He then repeated abuse at them via other means.
He will have a cushy repose at the pleasure of the state.
I agree there is a huge disparity in sentencing between different vehicle users, but let's not get away from the facts.
The man is remorseless, and bang to rights.
Let him rot in front of his PlayStation, and don't taint cyclists further by identifying with him.
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I believe this was all about contrition, or the lack of it.
argonsixar
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I was run down (and over) by a transit. The driver got out and attacked me on the ground. Only my riding buddy standing between me and the driver avoided me being assaulted further. The attacker got three months in prison. He had attacked and hurt several people (with a hammer in at least one other case) over several years and always avoided jail as the other victims didnt press charges.
The point here is that a deliberate attacker, known to the police and courts was jailed for 3 months. No one died but they could have (I certainly could have). Compare that with the kid who ran into the lady. He was a fool, not a deliberate assaulter. 18 months in an institution will not "cure him" of criminal behaviour or even teach him any worthwhile lessons.
I was run down (and over) by a transit. The driver got out and attacked me on the ground. Only my riding buddy standing between me and the driver avoided me being assaulted further. The attacker got three months in prison. He had attacked and hurt several people (with a hammer in at least one other case) over several years and always avoided jail as the other victims didnt press charges.
The point here is that a deliberate attacker, known to the police and courts was jailed for 3 months. No one died but they could have (I certainly could have). Compare that with the kid who ran into the lady. He was a fool, not a deliberate assaulter. 18 months in an institution will not "cure him" of criminal behaviour or even teach him any worthwhile lessons.
highlandsflyer
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I take your point about your attacker. I get the arguments for public safety sentencing versus punitive, but there was an element of intent in this cyclist's actions. Judging by the judge's remarks, he must have behaved as he did on more than one occasion. The question here then, for me, is why did your attacker receive such a lenient disposal? That is the bigger problem.
The headline sentence of 18 months is unlikely to be served fully, but it may get through to cyclists that their bikes must be in good order, and that may save a few lives.
The headline sentence of 18 months is unlikely to be served fully, but it may get through to cyclists that their bikes must be in good order, and that may save a few lives.
Silvergoat
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That's awful. The van man should have got way more on that and lost any privilege to drive at all. Good job you had a mate with.
The kid who ran into the lady was an unwitting fool, at worst. No one seems to have taken on board that the lady he crashed into stepped out into the road in front of him without looking. I experience this kind of thing everyday I commute by bike throughout London and it puts the fear of god into my now, in case I can't avoid anyone on foot stepping out in front of me. People are impatient or too distracted now and if you're not a car, bus or truck, they take their chance with people riding bikes. I would also call for a reintroduction of a national programme of educating all people on road safety, not just imposing legislation and requirements solely on cyclists – people just don't how to cross roads safely these days.
argonsixar":2p1yj55f said:
That's awful. The van man should have got way more on that and lost any privilege to drive at all. Good job you had a mate with.
The kid who ran into the lady was an unwitting fool, at worst. No one seems to have taken on board that the lady he crashed into stepped out into the road in front of him without looking. I experience this kind of thing everyday I commute by bike throughout London and it puts the fear of god into my now, in case I can't avoid anyone on foot stepping out in front of me. People are impatient or too distracted now and if you're not a car, bus or truck, they take their chance with people riding bikes. I would also call for a reintroduction of a national programme of educating all people on road safety, not just imposing legislation and requirements solely on cyclists – people just don't how to cross roads safely these days.
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I think you are all missing the point.
The letter of the law is there and can be used as a very blunt instrument against those who refuse to acknowledge their wrongdoings and the effect they have had on others. The restorative justice system relies upon this and has been successful in some instances. Whilst not knowing the specifics surrounding this particular case, it is my suggestion that due to the consistently unreflective attitude of the young man, and his failure to acknowledge his wrongdoing or the effects thereof, those that dealt with him at the scene, interviewing him, the CPS preparing the case, trying him and deciding his sentence have felt it necessary to use the full letter of the law in an attempt alter his undoubtedly pugnacious stance. The charges, subsequent press releases and Judge's comments appear to reflect this.
I'm not sure what influence the victim's husband would or could have had throughout this process but I suspect that regardless, the outcome would have been the same given the perpetrator's obvious failure of the 'attitude test' which I can assure you exists from the start of the process and can massively influence the route an offence can take though the criminal justice system from that point forward.
I write from personal experience both as an advocate for guilty parties and those seeking to prosecute them.
Only my view for what it's worth. That's not to denigrate the views of others which are equally valid.
The letter of the law is there and can be used as a very blunt instrument against those who refuse to acknowledge their wrongdoings and the effect they have had on others. The restorative justice system relies upon this and has been successful in some instances. Whilst not knowing the specifics surrounding this particular case, it is my suggestion that due to the consistently unreflective attitude of the young man, and his failure to acknowledge his wrongdoing or the effects thereof, those that dealt with him at the scene, interviewing him, the CPS preparing the case, trying him and deciding his sentence have felt it necessary to use the full letter of the law in an attempt alter his undoubtedly pugnacious stance. The charges, subsequent press releases and Judge's comments appear to reflect this.
I'm not sure what influence the victim's husband would or could have had throughout this process but I suspect that regardless, the outcome would have been the same given the perpetrator's obvious failure of the 'attitude test' which I can assure you exists from the start of the process and can massively influence the route an offence can take though the criminal justice system from that point forward.
I write from personal experience both as an advocate for guilty parties and those seeking to prosecute them.
Only my view for what it's worth. That's not to denigrate the views of others which are equally valid.
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If the bike would have had brakes, he would have been able to stop or at least slow down enough to avoid serious injuries.groovyblueshed":3o1u0vui said:
Have you been in traffic lately? The majority of cyclists ARE lawless menaces. No wonder everyone hates us.groovyblueshed":3o1u0vui said:
