British Steel
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feetabix said:Carl......thankfully we have you involved with our site!...longlive the good old fashioned geek!.....
Stands proudly for national anthem.....
Sorry Fellas....
Always had an interest in steel, and in Particular British frame builders, i didnt intend for the posts to seem geeky, just always felt the British bikes were always a little less coveted than they ought to be, considering what thought and effort went into them.
With all this said and done, not every one is aware of the efforts made by our English frame builders, in a market naturally dominated by America for obvious reasons.
And for whats its worth, i dont see any reason why NevadaSmiths british frames, should be percieved as anything less than on par with its American counter parts.
My example being Keith Bontragers Off road, and Ross Shafer"s Ala Carte....., both high end handbuilt frames, (this example being the closest comparison i could think of), with similar retail price points.
Rod_Saetan
Old School Grand Master
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In a general build quality desirability way they are on a parr, but the reason the Salsa and the Bontrager specifically are so revered and have continued to be highly desirable are because they set a precedent and dictated frame design. The Salsa's use of 71/73 geo was the benchmark for almost all frames from 89> I stopped paying attention and Keith's single-minded philosophy of getting the most out of a frame, a material, and a rider are why many people (myself included) consider the Race/Lite to be the best riding frame ever.
Thats not to say that the British builders didn't impress on history, or do anything to advance frame/bike design, but they were on the whole established road frame builders, borrowing other peoples geometry ideas and working to catch up with their US counterparts.
Im lucky enough to have a few American classics and a few British ones, and to my eye the craftsmanship (for that is the most relevant word when regarding these frames) of the Roberts and Lloyd exceeds that of the Salsa or Bontrager.
Thats not to say that the British builders didn't impress on history, or do anything to advance frame/bike design, but they were on the whole established road frame builders, borrowing other peoples geometry ideas and working to catch up with their US counterparts.
Im lucky enough to have a few American classics and a few British ones, and to my eye the craftsmanship (for that is the most relevant word when regarding these frames) of the Roberts and Lloyd exceeds that of the Salsa or Bontrager.
Both look like great projects. Its good to see folk like yourself keeping them alive.
I'd certainly echo others sentiments on handmade British frames. Lots of quality, skills and building heritage have gone into the frames you have there.
I'm looking forward to your updates.
I'd certainly echo others sentiments on handmade British frames. Lots of quality, skills and building heritage have gone into the frames you have there.
I'm looking forward to your updates.
feetabix
Retrobike Rider
sinnerman":g5vwun6f said:feetabix":g5vwun6f said:Carl......thankfully we have you involved with our site!...longlive the good old fashioned geek!.....
Stands proudly for national anthem.....
Sorry Fellas....
Always had an interest in steel, and in Particular British frame builders, i didnt intend for the posts to seem geeky, just always felt the British bikes were always a little less coveted than they ought to be, considering what thought and effort went into them.
With all this said and done, not every one is aware of the efforts made by our English frame builders, in a market naturally dominated by America for obvious reasons.
And for whats its worth, i dont see any reason why NevadaSmiths british frames, should be percieved as anything less than on par with its American counter parts.
My example being Keith Bontragers Off road, and Ross Shafer"s Ala Carte....., both high end handbuilt frames, (this example being the closest comparison i could think of), with similar retail price points.
hey....dont apologise!...we all love it....keep going!...
uno-speedo
BoTM Winner
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Rod_Saetan":19c92kqu said:
A lot of the old timer's in American frame building history can thank the British for learning their skills from Witcomb.
Hi Adrian, very nice projects, I'm looking forward to your progress. Here are some pictures of my 1990 Dave Yates Diabolo, best regards Daniel
Dave Yates Diabolo 1990 _03 von veloliebe auf Flickr
Dave Yates Diabolo 1990 _02 von veloliebe auf Flickr
Dave Yates Diabolo 1990 _01 von veloliebe auf Flickr
Dave Yates Diabolo 1990 _03 von veloliebe auf Flickr
Dave Yates Diabolo 1990 _02 von veloliebe auf Flickr
Dave Yates Diabolo 1990 _01 von veloliebe auf Flickr
Wow! What a great response - a real education in UK frame building facts thanks to all that have posted!
I have never seen that Lloyd e-stay before
There is something I really like about the Diablo's - I remember reading the reviews BITD and wanting one - I think because they were more obtainable cost wise than others but still had the kudos of a custom or top end frame.
What was the reason for UK builders not to use TIG as the US chaps did? Was it the tube sets that they selected, core skills (aerospace in the US?), tradition? The US seemed to drop fillet brazed around 90 where as the UK have kept with it. TIG must be cheaper, faster and lighter weight. ?) why didn't the UK follow?
Not after a UK v.s. US debate just after some thoughts - any US guys to comment? I have a Salsa Al la Carte and a FRO and I couldn't make a call on the quality - those bikes have some really lovely detail in the build details and they feel Bomb proof! I'd love a Bonty too one day.
I have only been able to view this thread on my phone since last night - looking forward to reading it in detail and viewing the images on a decent screen when I get home later in the week
Keep the UK steel pics coming
Anyone got an Orange Formula?
I have never seen that Lloyd e-stay before
There is something I really like about the Diablo's - I remember reading the reviews BITD and wanting one - I think because they were more obtainable cost wise than others but still had the kudos of a custom or top end frame.
What was the reason for UK builders not to use TIG as the US chaps did? Was it the tube sets that they selected, core skills (aerospace in the US?), tradition? The US seemed to drop fillet brazed around 90 where as the UK have kept with it. TIG must be cheaper, faster and lighter weight. ?) why didn't the UK follow?
Not after a UK v.s. US debate just after some thoughts - any US guys to comment? I have a Salsa Al la Carte and a FRO and I couldn't make a call on the quality - those bikes have some really lovely detail in the build details and they feel Bomb proof! I'd love a Bonty too one day.
I have only been able to view this thread on my phone since last night - looking forward to reading it in detail and viewing the images on a decent screen when I get home later in the week
Keep the UK steel pics coming
Anyone got an Orange Formula?
