Yet another lava dome!!! (1994)
- Thread starter bold stelvis
- Start date
DrDaveTampa
Retro Guru
Haha MX bar all day long, is this a trick question??? Well OK, maybe the nitto b80whatever maybe. Which I will admit is very pretty.
Part of it is, I just think a BMX stem works. Works aesthetically and works geometry wise, so, paired with some nice Renthals it gets me comfy but doesn't screw up the handling too much.
Nitto will be quite a bit lighter, I'll say that. But not as butch any way you cut it
Part of it is, I just think a BMX stem works. Works aesthetically and works geometry wise, so, paired with some nice Renthals it gets me comfy but doesn't screw up the handling too much.
Nitto will be quite a bit lighter, I'll say that. But not as butch any way you cut it
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
haha - yeah I kinda dig the mx bar too 
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
its interesting how the simple addition of a cross brace suddenly changes the vibe entirely
shape wise (inc rise) they appear pretty much identical to the Nitto B802s, - a chunk wider of course - but just look a lot more hardcore
shape wise (inc rise) they appear pretty much identical to the Nitto B802s, - a chunk wider of course - but just look a lot more hardcore
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
brakes and derailleur arrived today so lots of cleaning small parts (almost lost one of the bushings for the derailleur pulleys down the sink!)
hit a bit of a snag though I purchased some cool looking old tektro cantis for this - Tektro RBP 866 if I'm right. they look like these ones anyway:
They kinda look a little like Graftons if you don't look too closely
How these actually fit onto the brake bosses properly had me stumped for most of the day - one arm is fairly straightforward (the one with the quick release hook), but the other side has a significantly shorter/ wider spring and has an additional bushing that fits over the boss and for a good few hours I couldn't work out how the hell that side was supposed to work
eventually after doing some googling, I worked out that theres a 'doodah' that fits over the boss before that arm/spring assembly goes on that takes up the 'spare room' on the boss and is presumably there as some kind of frankly pretty bodgy tension adjuster (this doodah is the odd angled darker coloured thing at the bottom right of the photo - on the ebay set above it seems to be a single piece with the bushing, but on the ones I bought the bushing itself is separate)
Anyway, having now worked out how the damn things are supposed to go on, I seem to be missing one of the said doodahs (the risk of cheap 2nd hand internet purchases I guess) - and also one of the cone washers that sits under the main break bolt (maybe less of an issue, but still a bummer)
I have gone back to the seller to ask if maybe these were somehow left out but given these apparently didn't come of their own bike, I am not getting my hopes up...
don't suppose anybody has any of these missing bits spare?
I can get another complete set of the bay of course, but at that point the expense seems like its not worth it - don't think these were particularly 'posh' when new BITD
hit a bit of a snag though I purchased some cool looking old tektro cantis for this - Tektro RBP 866 if I'm right. they look like these ones anyway:
They kinda look a little like Graftons if you don't look too closely
How these actually fit onto the brake bosses properly had me stumped for most of the day - one arm is fairly straightforward (the one with the quick release hook), but the other side has a significantly shorter/ wider spring and has an additional bushing that fits over the boss and for a good few hours I couldn't work out how the hell that side was supposed to work
eventually after doing some googling, I worked out that theres a 'doodah' that fits over the boss before that arm/spring assembly goes on that takes up the 'spare room' on the boss and is presumably there as some kind of frankly pretty bodgy tension adjuster (this doodah is the odd angled darker coloured thing at the bottom right of the photo - on the ebay set above it seems to be a single piece with the bushing, but on the ones I bought the bushing itself is separate)
Anyway, having now worked out how the damn things are supposed to go on, I seem to be missing one of the said doodahs (the risk of cheap 2nd hand internet purchases I guess) - and also one of the cone washers that sits under the main break bolt (maybe less of an issue, but still a bummer)
I have gone back to the seller to ask if maybe these were somehow left out but given these apparently didn't come of their own bike, I am not getting my hopes up...
don't suppose anybody has any of these missing bits spare?
I can get another complete set of the bay of course, but at that point the expense seems like its not worth it - don't think these were particularly 'posh' when new BITD
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
if I can get these to work I think they might have enough adjustment range for 27.5 inch wheels which could be an interesting variation....
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
ok after some searching it seems the doodah is better know as a spring adjustment cap or spring tension adjustment nut and several brakes rom different manufacturers feature a similar mechanism (incuding Paul brakes) though its often placed (with the spring) at the front rather than the rear as in my case
I'm kinda thinking that as long as the 'height' is around the right width pretty much any of the alternatives might potentially work - its literally a short barrel with a spanner flat and a hole for the spring designed to sit on a brake boss. Dia-compe 986/987/984, etc all seem to feature these for example as do all Paul brakes
the issue is finding spares - I can get the Paul's ones but they cost 4 times as much as I paid for the brakes!
best bet is maybe this (upgrade pack for a dia-compe U brake that features two of them which would cover me)
https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/comp...n=froogle&cid=GBP&glCurrency=GBP&glCountry=GB
this might work as well:
https://www.skatepro.uk/259-51824.htm
again, unless anyone has anything similar lying around they could spare?
I'm kinda thinking that as long as the 'height' is around the right width pretty much any of the alternatives might potentially work - its literally a short barrel with a spanner flat and a hole for the spring designed to sit on a brake boss. Dia-compe 986/987/984, etc all seem to feature these for example as do all Paul brakes
the issue is finding spares - I can get the Paul's ones but they cost 4 times as much as I paid for the brakes!
best bet is maybe this (upgrade pack for a dia-compe U brake that features two of them which would cover me)
https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/comp...n=froogle&cid=GBP&glCurrency=GBP&glCountry=GB
this might work as well:
https://www.skatepro.uk/259-51824.htm
again, unless anyone has anything similar lying around they could spare?
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
I'm probably completely over thinking this, but nothing better to do while I wait for parts to arrive!
What's the best design for straddle yokes?
the brakes came with this skeleton style, but was wondering if anyone had tried a roller pulley style? (Like Rene Herse cantis) - feels like it might work better as I noticed most of the initial cable pull is just taking lots of slack out of the straddle cable and the angle set by the hanger doesn't seem to adjust especially well as the cable gets pulled tighter
do the shimano style ones work better?
Another other thing I noticed (and I think this is a known 'issue' with clamped cables on canti's) is that the straddle cable on the quick release side feels like it works much more efficiently than the clamped on side as it has some freedom to rotate as the yoke angle changes. Even with spring tension setup to be pretty evenly, that side of the brake seems to react more quickly and have less issues with cable slack
A DIY 'upgrade' to replace the fixed clamp with some sort of rotating barrel clamp could be an idea (you can buy similar barrel clamps but jigging the attachment to allow free rotation might require a little bodging)
this is the spring adjuster cap/nut I am missing on one set
What's the best design for straddle yokes?
the brakes came with this skeleton style, but was wondering if anyone had tried a roller pulley style? (Like Rene Herse cantis) - feels like it might work better as I noticed most of the initial cable pull is just taking lots of slack out of the straddle cable and the angle set by the hanger doesn't seem to adjust especially well as the cable gets pulled tighter
do the shimano style ones work better?
Another other thing I noticed (and I think this is a known 'issue' with clamped cables on canti's) is that the straddle cable on the quick release side feels like it works much more efficiently than the clamped on side as it has some freedom to rotate as the yoke angle changes. Even with spring tension setup to be pretty evenly, that side of the brake seems to react more quickly and have less issues with cable slack
A DIY 'upgrade' to replace the fixed clamp with some sort of rotating barrel clamp could be an idea (you can buy similar barrel clamps but jigging the attachment to allow free rotation might require a little bodging)
this is the spring adjuster cap/nut I am missing on one set
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
Now that I've got some suitable forks on the way, and look to have hunted down a suitably scruffy flite Ti for some custom refurb ideas (more on that later) the next item to sort is pedals
while I am a fan of refurbishing old parts to give them new life, I am also not especially a fan of getting gouged for 'vintage retro' stuff
given the era of the frame some old school MTB flat pedals from the early 90s would seem ideal
good ones from this era seem to be very pricey however - even very beat up and worn M730 or M735 XT pedals seem to go for more money than I think is sensible
other cool choices from the same era would be Suntour XC pros (same issues on availability and cost)
or Sakae Low Fats (probably my fav on looks)
With all of these cost vs condition on the 2nd hand market is likely to be an issue - Don't really want to make do with lesser models that have drawbacks like non removable cages (eg Deore LX M560s, Suntour XC comps, etc)
The alternative is a modern "homage" pedal - quite digging the MKS Esprits on that front (and they have the advantage of being both new and probably a bunch cheaper!) - interested to hear thoughts!
while I am a fan of refurbishing old parts to give them new life, I am also not especially a fan of getting gouged for 'vintage retro' stuff
given the era of the frame some old school MTB flat pedals from the early 90s would seem ideal
good ones from this era seem to be very pricey however - even very beat up and worn M730 or M735 XT pedals seem to go for more money than I think is sensible
other cool choices from the same era would be Suntour XC pros (same issues on availability and cost)
or Sakae Low Fats (probably my fav on looks)
With all of these cost vs condition on the 2nd hand market is likely to be an issue - Don't really want to make do with lesser models that have drawbacks like non removable cages (eg Deore LX M560s, Suntour XC comps, etc)
The alternative is a modern "homage" pedal - quite digging the MKS Esprits on that front (and they have the advantage of being both new and probably a bunch cheaper!) - interested to hear thoughts!
bold stelvis
Kona Fan
update
have managed to scavenge quite a few of the bits I need off the bay or some kind folks here, most importantly a set of P2s in the right size.
pros - tripled butted, and structurally seem to be in reasonable shape. They fit the head tube literally perfectly length wise.
cons - paint is pretty ratty - stickers had half disintegrated so they came off. Also I had to shim the crown race seat with some coke can which was a bit weird - noticed a previous owner had literally tried to wrap twine around the seat presumably for the same reason. Cost more than the frame which hurts
plan is to repaint these I think, together with whatever stem I end up with.
eagle eyed viewers will have noticed the super bodged fork mounted canti-hanger!!
Don't worry - I have procured a proper one which is on its way to bold towers. The bodge is pretty much as lethal as it looks, but was enough for me to at least get some sort of temp build done to get a feel for how it was coming together
Stem is a slightly later '96 dark grey alloy velocity which I started to sand down to the bare alloy - will complete at some point when it comes to paint (forks and stem only - gonna leave the frame as is with some tidy ups). I have procured a quill convertor also, as the big wide clamp on the velocity is not going to work with the various bar options I would like to try, but thought I'd like to start with the cockpit more or less in standard Kona mode
Lots of bits have been nicked of my Klein and thrown on for now as a temporary stop-gap until I make decisions on the final build - bars, 10 speed rear drive train, trigger shifters, wheels and tyres. Still planning on 9 speed rear and have a nice condition M739 RD ready to go but currently lack a spare 9 speed shifter so 10 speed cassette and fugly zee hanging off the back for now. Suspect the hanger is slightly bent which I'll need to sort as well. Wheels will eventually get replaced with some more suitable shiny alloy (and some new tyres at that point also)
Before getting to this point I was concerned that theoretically the frame geo with a standard flat bar was going to be too long and low for me to deal with, but it wasn't as bad as I thought - the geometry fundamentals are actually very similar to my Klein. Reach is about right - maybe a little on the long side by a couple of cm (easily dealt with via a shorter stem), but it IS quite lowish at the front and a short test ride definitely had me feeling like I had too much weight on the hands - so some bar and stem experiments to come.
First ride felt good though - just a short trip to meet some colleagues for lunch - even the cantis felt ok - at first at least!
On the way back it started raining quite heavily and suddenly the rear brake which had felt totally fine on the way out when it was dry (I could lock up the wheel quite easily) was not doing much at all in the rain - my thought is maybe old brake shoes? (they are koolstop pads, but have no idea how old they are)
I have nice set of avid arch Vee's normally on the klein and TBH they may end up on here instead of the cantis after all, though I'll probably try some new brake pads (salmon koolstops probably) and get the front hanger sorted properly first to see if that makes a difference.
saddle is an old school WTB speed V on a freshly sanded and polished Ritchey WCS post:
I kinda like it (it matches the red on the panaracers!), but it weighs a ton and @Gtpulse kindly sorted me out with an old knackered flite Ti I intend to re-cover - more on that later, but here's a gratuitous nude shot after painstakingly removing the old leather and doing a bunch of sanding and filling holes on the foam (silicon bathroom sealer works great for this)
have managed to scavenge quite a few of the bits I need off the bay or some kind folks here, most importantly a set of P2s in the right size.
pros - tripled butted, and structurally seem to be in reasonable shape. They fit the head tube literally perfectly length wise.
cons - paint is pretty ratty - stickers had half disintegrated so they came off. Also I had to shim the crown race seat with some coke can which was a bit weird - noticed a previous owner had literally tried to wrap twine around the seat presumably for the same reason. Cost more than the frame which hurts
plan is to repaint these I think, together with whatever stem I end up with.
eagle eyed viewers will have noticed the super bodged fork mounted canti-hanger!!
Don't worry - I have procured a proper one which is on its way to bold towers. The bodge is pretty much as lethal as it looks, but was enough for me to at least get some sort of temp build done to get a feel for how it was coming together
Stem is a slightly later '96 dark grey alloy velocity which I started to sand down to the bare alloy - will complete at some point when it comes to paint (forks and stem only - gonna leave the frame as is with some tidy ups). I have procured a quill convertor also, as the big wide clamp on the velocity is not going to work with the various bar options I would like to try, but thought I'd like to start with the cockpit more or less in standard Kona mode
Lots of bits have been nicked of my Klein and thrown on for now as a temporary stop-gap until I make decisions on the final build - bars, 10 speed rear drive train, trigger shifters, wheels and tyres. Still planning on 9 speed rear and have a nice condition M739 RD ready to go but currently lack a spare 9 speed shifter so 10 speed cassette and fugly zee hanging off the back for now. Suspect the hanger is slightly bent which I'll need to sort as well. Wheels will eventually get replaced with some more suitable shiny alloy (and some new tyres at that point also)
Before getting to this point I was concerned that theoretically the frame geo with a standard flat bar was going to be too long and low for me to deal with, but it wasn't as bad as I thought - the geometry fundamentals are actually very similar to my Klein. Reach is about right - maybe a little on the long side by a couple of cm (easily dealt with via a shorter stem), but it IS quite lowish at the front and a short test ride definitely had me feeling like I had too much weight on the hands - so some bar and stem experiments to come.
First ride felt good though - just a short trip to meet some colleagues for lunch - even the cantis felt ok - at first at least!
On the way back it started raining quite heavily and suddenly the rear brake which had felt totally fine on the way out when it was dry (I could lock up the wheel quite easily) was not doing much at all in the rain - my thought is maybe old brake shoes? (they are koolstop pads, but have no idea how old they are)
I have nice set of avid arch Vee's normally on the klein and TBH they may end up on here instead of the cantis after all, though I'll probably try some new brake pads (salmon koolstops probably) and get the front hanger sorted properly first to see if that makes a difference.
saddle is an old school WTB speed V on a freshly sanded and polished Ritchey WCS post:
I kinda like it (it matches the red on the panaracers!), but it weighs a ton and @Gtpulse kindly sorted me out with an old knackered flite Ti I intend to re-cover - more on that later, but here's a gratuitous nude shot after painstakingly removing the old leather and doing a bunch of sanding and filling holes on the foam (silicon bathroom sealer works great for this)
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