Security bubble

[marky2484]

Could have been worse....he could have tried selling a few papers - then seen what happens when "Highly trained " policemen use proportionate force....

 

[silverclaws]

was the over rough handling of a child that got me nothing to do with if he was on a bike or not as far as i'm concerned,

There is that too, the bike makes it worse, but interesting the leading car hit the brakes it was that close, so endangerment is in my mind. But nothing must stop the torch it is the most important thing in the UK of today the world is watching and woe betide any citizen that steps out of line.

But as to coppers doing wrong, they must accept criticism as they do praise to make them human and not just the face of the machine as everyone knows the police is a largely thankless job and always has been.

 

[Whatleymeister]

I can see why its being guarded like it is, so the likes of the two herberts that tried to take it and hold things up the other day dont succeed. However, when you look at that instance (i am on my phone so cant link at the moment!) the level of force was far less severe and there was two of them. They simply stopped them, returned the torch and it went on its merry way. No lynching people into the path of a car, no headlocks. It was appropriate.

Clearly, and I am sure you will all agree, there is a line between necessary and excessive force. Personaly, I think it was a bit over the top to pull themselves in front of a car.

Also, FMJ, too mich info mate!!

 

[Chopper the ex Copper]

Could have been worse....he could have tried selling a few papers - then seen what happens when "Highly trained " policemen use proportionate force....

Well, if you're gonna moan you may as well get your facts straight. Matey on London was not a newspaper seller - he was an unemployed, rough sleeping alcoholic man who spent his days sat at the kerb alongside a newspaper seller he had befriended. He did not have a job of any kind himelf. Try not to believe everything the media blindly regurgitate.

As for our our Olympic bubble boy... perhaps he had a paper round?

 

[tintin40]

not a newspaper seller - he was an unemployed, rough sleeping alcoholic man who spent his days sat at the kerb alongside a newspaper seller he had befriended. He did not have a job of any kind himelf. Try not to believe everything the media blindly regurgitate.

Does that make it OK to push him over & hit with a baton? Oh and set the dog on him. Lucky it was on video or the plod could have walked away from it.

 

[xerxes]

Did anyone see Dispatches the other night: http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/4od

Let's face it, sports is secondary, this is a tax funded, massively expensive and over budget, huge advertising billbord and money making scheme for a bunch of big businesses, some of which have pretty dubious reputations, whether it be environmentally, finacially or human rights.

I predict that it will have little if any lasting benefit to UK sport, the tax paying public that paid for it or the people in the immediate area of the white elephants being constructed in their vicinity. I do predict a brief increase in profits for the official sponsers that bought the right to peddle their wares at the games and for all the firms won lucrative publicly funded construction and service contracts for the games.

Cynical, me?

 

[silverclaws]

Could have been worse....he could have tried selling a few papers - then seen what happens when "Highly trained " policemen use proportionate force....

Well, if you're gonna moan you may as well get your facts straight. Matey on London was not a newspaper seller - he was an unemployed, rough sleeping alcoholic man who spent his days sat at the kerb alongside a newspaper seller he had befriended. He did not have a job of any kind himelf. Try not to believe everything the media blindly regurgitate.

As for our our Olympic bubble boy... perhaps he had a paper round?

Does the truth of what the person was beyond what the media has told everyone else is the case make the situation any less ?

But surprising of the media to lie as it is usual with them to put the boot in first regards the apparent feckless, or is it they thought they could make more political hay by making everyone believe something different and with that perhaps it is wise to watch the media because they are in the business of making money

But if what they have told everyone is a lie perhaps someone needs to tell them to get their facts right and correct their mistakes publicly, because everyone thinking something different has the potential to create news and with that harm to innocent people.

 

[Chopper the ex Copper]

not a newspaper seller - he was an unemployed, rough sleeping alcoholic man who spent his days sat at the kerb alongside a newspaper seller he had befriended. He did not have a job of any kind himelf. Try not to believe everything the media blindly regurgitate.

Does that make it OK to push him over & hit with a baton? Oh and set the dog on him. Lucky it was on video or the plod could have walked away from it.

Are you asking me, or telling me?

Im wavering on that one - textbook double palm heel strike, low strike with is peg. Both precisely by the book, as I've been taught them.

Against a make who was persistently decking to comply with reasonable and lawful requests? I'm not so sure on the one. The gent was not walking home as he simply didn't have one. He was in almost continuous contact with police lines for 40 minutes without a lawful or reasonable excuse.

On the other, the bloke was not an immediate threat to my mind, and with the benefit of hindsight was probably suffering with auditory exclusion due to impending sudden onset of a serious medical condition.

Then in the middle the bobby has done, to my mind, a terrible job justifying his actions relying too much on stock phrases instead of detailing profiled offender behaviour, impact factors and determining a reasonable and lawful response. S117 PACE, S3 Criminal Law Act, S2 ECHR and Common Law all make the use of force - even deadly force - legal if it is necessary and propotionate, two words this bobby has banded about a lot but with little to support it.

I'm an expert in UDT and I really, genuinely odon't know. Whatever happens, and with the piss poor defence material the bobby has offered I can see him being found guilty, I think we may well see either new law, or some heavyweight clarification or guidance of the current law on use of force.

As a total aside I'm qualified to teach UDT for bicycle patrol officers.

PS- sorry for the iPhone itis.

 

[dyna-ti]

I suppose we could wait for a torchbearer to get assaulted, then all whittle on about how ineffective the dibble are.

I've had direct involvement with the Met team providing the close security and know what they've been briefed, and the number of threats they are looking out for is phenomenal, and the time in which they have to make a tactical decision is infentissimal. When it comes down to it no one was hurt, happy ending.

Could've been a lot, lot worse - what do you think those lads are carrying in those F.A.G. bags?

Sorry,cant see the problem here after watching it several times:? the kid doesnt look like hes going to ride at the bearer his front wheel points that way then turns to go straight past the the other security lassie but is smashed down by the usual heavy handedness :?
As to these threats you speak of? name some but try to exclude the ones labelled under terrorism.as i see that piece of legal dross being used against little old ladies,peaceful protesters[usually little old ladies] and now children.

When it comes down to it no one was hurt, happy ending.

Unlike the last poor chap body slammed to the ground by an overzealous constable.

Could've been a lot, lot worse - what do you think those lads are carrying in those F.A.G. bags?

Unlikely, as the rider wasnt carrying a table leg

 

[Chopper the ex Copper]

Threats to harm runners, steal the torch. Some of it specific, some of it based upon information received. I mean, what do you hobestly think? Vnot likely that the Morris Dancers Action Front are planning to throw daisies.

You may also recall the two young teenagers who tried to steal the torch in Coventry, and that was probably only seen by the lads as a jolly jape.

And yes, right through to terrorism. Chats why you got a bevy of security all packing P26's. They're not carrying them to scare the Morris Men, and the Rapiers arent on London rooftops to impress New Fathers4Justice.

Now, without being sneaky and looking on Google, or mentioning terrorism , tell us all about the National Decision Making Model. I know reams of this stuff, I'm qualified to instruct and teach much of it and I'm pretty ambivalent about most of this, taking the middle ground. You doubtless couldn't tell me what a Hindi Cap is but seem to feel qualified to make such sweeping judgements based on no knowledge or experience.

The lad was demonstrating profiled offender behaviour and the officer deployed primary control skills to handle it. Legal, proportionate, by the book. Not liking it doesnt really change that it was technically spot on.