'Handling' - what influences our sense of - a discussion

[mrkawasaki]

Okay, I've been musing on this issue since I read my first bike reviews back in 1990 and wondered what REALLY influences the way in which a rider feels then describes how a bike handles to another rider....

Here's a list of the main components (in no particular order) - all you have to do to create a starting point for this debate, is to re-order them into the most significant (top) to the least (bottom) of your list.

Tyres - size
Tyres - pressure
Frame material
Frame design
Frame geometry
Frame size - to specific rider
Frame size - general
Forks - material
Forks - design
Forks - suspension type/travel
Saddle
Seatpost
Grips - type
Stem
Bars - position/type
Tyres - size
Tyres - pressure
Other - list

 

[tintin40]

Frame design
Frame size - to specific rider
Frame geometry
Frame material
Stem
Bars - position/type
Saddle
Seatpost
Tyres - pressure
Tyres - size
Grips - type

 

[Gruff]

Frame design
Frame size - to specific rider
Frame geometry
Frame material
Stem
Bars - position/type
Saddle
Seatpost
Tyres - pressure
Tyres - size
Grips - type

What Tintin said

 

[mikee]

i'd say first of all is the fit of the rider
if you feel comfy on a bike it gives you the confidence to go fast
then the actual bicycle performance factors kick in

 

[Anthony]

I'm not sure it makes sense to try to prioritise these factors, as the best design entails finding the best balance between several factors. For example, the more travel you want, the longer the fork will be, and thus the slacker the head angle. The longer the fork, the shorter the stem needs to be (or the more sweep in the bars, which is equivalent), to preserve sharp handling. The shorter the stem, the longer the top tube you need, to preserve fit. It is only by balancing those factors that you will have a good-handling bike, no one of them is more important than the others and any one of them in isolation won't do the job.

I would however agree that most of the factors you mention are subsidiary to what I have said, and to wheelbase and posture. Once you have those right, you can vary tyre size and pressure to taste, but tyre size and pressure won't rescue a poor basic design.

 

[mrkawasaki]

I think it's fair to say we all like to describe our bikes handling characteristics as though they are a common experience, those feelings somehow translatable to other riders - influential magazine reviews wouldn't exist otherwise.

The question I posed was not to 'prioritise' in the sense of designing a bike from a blank page, but, in light of riding experience, what have we found that influences our interpretation of 'handling'. Wait till I do my list of handling descriptives!

I figured if there was a common agreement in the hierarchy, we could then consider the subtleties of items higher up that list and minimise the influence of the 'red herrings' lower down the order.

Very few of us have custom built frames and I for one, wouldn't know how to begin to specify such a thing. The current state of play is that we all have a lot of second hand bikes with great 'reputations', which in reality don't actually fit (like a custom build should) - therefore we try and make them work to the best of our abilities and experience, using many items in the list to make our bikes 'work' more effectively. Can we go from an average man/bike starting point and make an excellent handling bike?

 

[Drencrom]

Are we talking handling or 'feel' - they are interconnected, but if it's the overall feeling of a well set-up bike then it's a myriad of little details on top of the fundamentals for me.

 

[Anthony]

I don't think you need a custom built frame to have a custom bike. The first of these two frames is a size 16 and the other is a size 18, but both bikes are the same size and they both handle the same. I made them that way.

 

[legrandefromage]

What may work for one may not work for another - and its very hard to quantify what makes a specific frame and fork combination tick and even harder to tell someone else (who will have there own prejudices) why it works for you.

I've owned and ridden getting on for a thousand bikes in 25 years of riding and only a handful had that 'magic' feel that everything is 'right'. And my choice of bikes that have been right will in no way be someone elses.

Promising frame materials have often turned out to be a disappointment - preconceptions of how a given material should ride are often in complete reverse to how the bike rides and how much money you've just spent on the damn thing.

My best bike in years has been something I found recently yet it has a brand name most of you wouldnt be seen dead on. I actually enjoy riding again rather than trying to make up for the shortcomings of other designs/ builds.

Our hobby can be so cheap that you can kiss many frogs before a princess turns up - but it is a known fact that some have spent many fortunes on princess, only to wake up in the morning and find they've bought a dog.

 

[hamster]

Frame geometry is probably the most important, along with fork rake and steering trail; but much of the feel comes from the tyre choice I suspect.
Frame materials are way down my list. In the dark I can't discern the difference between Ti, Steel and Alu.

My Litespeed road bike took two years to get right in fit - so tweaking with position makes a huge difference in feel.

But my favourite bike of all is a 1990 Marin Palisades built up as a drop bar tourer. It needs the sturdy tubing for rigidity when loaded, and just feels right. I often wonder about getting it copied in (say) XACD Ti just to see the differences.