Cyclists who kill

[Mickeyspinn]

This has really got under my skin, there's something fundamentally flawed here

https://www.itv.com/news/anglia/202...ifying-moments-before-crash-which-killed-baby

To me what is fundamentally flawed with the legal system is profit...

 

[nstarmore]

@grantoury

Because the UK Highway Code is made in a utter dream world with some of the most stupid out of date ideals.

Other countries adopted a road hierarchy backed up with a default legal position years and years ago as a corner stone. It's pretty much on the lines that the more damage you can potentially inflict on a more vulnerable road user, the more you will be in the wrong.

Is that not the hierarchy that was recently introduced here (that a lot of people kicked off about, I may add). Sounds to me like the article displays intent for that legal backing coming into force as well. The article is sensationalist but people wouldn't read it otherwise, so kind of the point.

 

[Woz]

Is that not the hierarchy that was recently introduced here (that a lot of people kicked off about, I may add). Sounds to me like the article displays intent for that legal backing coming into force as well. The article is sensationalist but people wouldn't read it otherwise, so kind of the point.

Not living the UK anymore, I had to check out you said. Typical BBC, spout some emotions over an incidence but not reference the crux of the matter. The UK will need to go through a few generations to produce a real culture change here. It's so overdue IMHO.

Italy, an HGV would not dream of bullying the tiniest of tiny farty Fiat Pandas.

My own experience in France on minor roads, cycling two abreast - a lorry in the distance behind gives a short peep on the horn. We turn around and it's a double articulated lorry working for the foresting industry. It's that type of non-threating peep on the horn to say "look, I'm here". There is no chance the guy can overtake - he and us know the roads. He stays behind us and gives a little short peep prior to the moment when it's a chance to overtake - and we know this too. We single file out and practically ride on the grass verge. The HGV that passes us is a monster. At the end of day the man as job to do against the clock which we are aware of. We get a double peep from the HGV driver in recognition when he passes safely and a token of thanks.

That to me is about sharing the road. Safely with no road rage.

 

[nstarmore]

Ahh I see, yeh it's going to take a while to inbed that mentality and I think it's not going to be until a few are made an example of unfortunately (I dare say most car drivers are still oblivious to any changes) , but I agree it's well overdue.

Funnily enough I was holidaying in France a couple weeks back and did notice how well the hierarchy works and it makes for a much easier life for everyone, in fact France just works better in most respects, much more relaxing place to be than here.

 

[hookooekoo]

Once the law changes it's only a matter of time before a cyclist leaves the scene of an accident. A single case will then be used to try and ram through mandatory registration and licence plates for bikes. You just know it's gonna happen, because the people who hate cyclists will be even more furious that they got what they wanted, but the evil cyclists are still getting away with murder.

 

[hookooekoo]

The way the propaganda media work in this country, is to get people irate and annoyed over something that doesn't really affect them, rather than tell all the facts.

Just remember folks, you will always sell more tickets for a ghost train, than a speak your weight machine.

Just wait until you see the queue and spectators around one of these machines on a Friday or Saturday night!

 

[Mickeyspinn]

Not living the UK anymore, I had to check out you said. Typical BBC, spout some emotions over an incidence but not reference the crux of the matter. The UK will need to go through a few generations to produce a real culture change here. It's so overdue IMHO.

Italy, an HGV would not dream of bullying the tiniest of tiny farty Fiat Pandas.

My own experience in France on minor roads, cycling two abreast - a lorry in the distance behind gives a short peep on the horn. We turn around and it's a double articulated lorry working for the foresting industry. It's that type of non-threating peep on the horn to say "look, I'm here". There is no chance the guy can overtake - he and us know the roads. He stays behind us and gives a little short peep prior to the moment when it's a chance to overtake - and we know this too. We single file out and practically ride on the grass verge. The HGV that passes us is a monster. At the end of day the man as job to do against the clock which we are aware of. We get a double peep from the HGV driver in recognition when he passes safely and a token of thanks.

That to me is about sharing the road. Safely with no road rage.

I've never felt more comfortable and safe than when cycling french roads... Paris and Nantes I was amazed at how set up for cyclists it was.
I did a little refresh of the road laws re cyclists before the last peddle about in France and it seems the common sense of heirachy has been ingrained for a long time....shocked that on most roads a cyclist has the right to go through red lights.....at their risk if course. Such common sense....helps keeps snarled up traffic and cyclists away from each other .....gonna take a long long time here to reach that point...

 

[hookooekoo]

Not living the UK anymore, I had to check out you said. Typical BBC, spout some emotions over an incidence but not reference the crux of the matter. The UK will need to go through a few generations to produce a real culture change here. It's so overdue IMHO.

Italy, an HGV would not dream of bullying the tiniest of tiny farty Fiat Pandas.

My own experience in France on minor roads, cycling two abreast - a lorry in the distance behind gives a short peep on the horn. We turn around and it's a double articulated lorry working for the foresting industry. It's that type of non-threating peep on the horn to say "look, I'm here". There is no chance the guy can overtake - he and us know the roads. He stays behind us and gives a little short peep prior to the moment when it's a chance to overtake - and we know this too. We single file out and practically ride on the grass verge. The HGV that passes us is a monster. At the end of day the man as job to do against the clock which we are aware of. We get a double peep from the HGV driver in recognition when he passes safely and a token of thanks.

That to me is about sharing the road. Safely with no road rage.

I did a little cycle touring in France a long time ago, and was impressed by how much more considerate the average French driver was than motorists back home. I think it helps that cycling is the national sport in France, although I'm sure they're now getting rather fed up with the long wait for a French cyclist to win Le Tour again. The only negative thing I recall was the huge number of noisy, smelly two strokes, but maybe that has changed.

 

[Mickeyspinn]

I did a little cycle touring in France a long time ago, and was impressed by how much more considerate the average French driver was than motorists back home. I think it helps that cycling is the national sport in France, although I'm sure they're now getting rather fed up with the long wait for a French cyclist to win Le Tour again. The only negative thing I recall was the huge number of noisy, smelly two strokes, but maybe that has changed.

Haha those funny little two stroke cars that drink drivers get relegated to....atleast you hear them coming!

 

[hookooekoo]

A most excellent point.

If I made so much as an idle threat to shoot someone, my shotgun would be confiscated (a Beretta Silver Pigeon sporter in rare stainless finish, before anyone asks) and there is no question that I would ever get my ticket back as long as I lived.

Actually kill someone in a car and theres a good chance of not even going to prison, and within a few years at worst will be legally able to get behind the wheel of a kinetic weapon again.

Why the disparity?

Every month motorists kill enough people to fill a decent sized airliner, yet this is somehow just seen by society at large as the cost of doing business rather than a real problem that needs tackling.

I think the disparity is because the average jury consists of motorists who are of the mind that 'accidents happen', and with respect to the motorist they might well be thinking 'that could have been me in the dock'. Some kind of training is required before juries hear these cases, because most people don't seem to understand that the majority of these fatalities were totally preventable and weren't an 'accident'. The length of the bans typically given out is pitiful. Some should never be allowed to drive again. And many need to spend at least 10 years maturing before they're allowed another go.