There's always been crashes on descents, but I'm left wondering if those deep section carbon rims are exacerbating the problem. They are more likely to be affected by changes in wind, esp in mountains where the wind doesn't always blow in one direction and swirls around corners and cliff edges
Anther death on a dangerous decent
- Thread starter tintin40
- Start date
Frankenorange
Orange 🍊 Fan
Remco is saying these things because downhill is his weak point. I think he is a rider who would be very happy if stages were only flat/rolling/uphill.
I haven't got any stats to hand but i think there has been an equal number of death/disability, from crashes or getting wiped out by cars/motorbikes, in pro cycling on flattish terrain as on alpine descents over quite a few decades. There have been a few heart attacks, too.
Actually; if i think about it i think there might have been as many deaths and disabilities from crashes on velodromes, in the same time period. Regarding velodromes; if you go back to the days of Major Taylor, when motor pacing on the track was a big thing, velodromes might actually top the list. They had some god awful accidents back then with all the steam powered motorbikes and tandem/quad pacing events. Spectators dying or getting maimed, too.
Training still worst for bad outcomes, by a long stretch, and that seems more likely to happen at the roundabout a few hundred meters from home than on a mountain 100 miles away.
I haven't got any stats to hand but i think there has been an equal number of death/disability, from crashes or getting wiped out by cars/motorbikes, in pro cycling on flattish terrain as on alpine descents over quite a few decades. There have been a few heart attacks, too.
Actually; if i think about it i think there might have been as many deaths and disabilities from crashes on velodromes, in the same time period. Regarding velodromes; if you go back to the days of Major Taylor, when motor pacing on the track was a big thing, velodromes might actually top the list. They had some god awful accidents back then with all the steam powered motorbikes and tandem/quad pacing events. Spectators dying or getting maimed, too.
Training still worst for bad outcomes, by a long stretch, and that seems more likely to happen at the roundabout a few hundred meters from home than on a mountain 100 miles away.
georges1
Retro Guru
If you recall untill a recent time only a rim brakes were used , now disc brakes are used but I think if the person hasn't a certain level of riding in descent or in climb as well isn't trained enough, is a source of risk. Have disc brakes proven better than rim brakes and prevented less injhuries that is debattable. If a person thinks the risk of fatal injury or crash is too high it is better not participate at competition event. The person always need to evaluate the situation during training and regarding her capacities
Theres an unsanctioned race in pittsburg where only the climbs are timed. Nobody wants a high speed race through the city.
Here youve got pros with pro skills making pro choices but… they basically need to ride right to their limit and beyond for their paycheck. And theyre young men. Pretty much a bloodsport. Dog fighting is illegal and this should be too. Inhumane.
Wider tires and better brakes wont help, theyd mean even faster speeds. If they could put in 10 miles of pillows then sure, but not realistic, only fix is to reduce the speeds.
Not sure how to do it to support breakaways. Maybe a fleet of officials on bikes and a strict 20mph limit for the descent? Maybe speedometers and time penalty if you exceed the speed limit. Theres precedent to neutralize a race then restart fairly.
Here youve got pros with pro skills making pro choices but… they basically need to ride right to their limit and beyond for their paycheck. And theyre young men. Pretty much a bloodsport. Dog fighting is illegal and this should be too. Inhumane.
Wider tires and better brakes wont help, theyd mean even faster speeds. If they could put in 10 miles of pillows then sure, but not realistic, only fix is to reduce the speeds.
Not sure how to do it to support breakaways. Maybe a fleet of officials on bikes and a strict 20mph limit for the descent? Maybe speedometers and time penalty if you exceed the speed limit. Theres precedent to neutralize a race then restart fairly.
Aech
GT Fan
The simple fact is these people choose to do this for a living, people are killed at work in just about every profession, should we ban work entirely ?
I'd hate to see descents neutralised or avoided altogether, Sprinters don't enjoy the mountain stages, the climbing specialists don't enjoy time trialling, the time trial specialists don't contest bunch sprints...
There are sections of each race that individual riders will shine at and other bits where they will struggle, if you want to get rid of descending as a skill for safety reasons then also get rid of bunch sprints and riding in the middle of a peloton and riding in the rain and riding when it's windy etc etc
In fact you might as well stick them all on stationary bikes and just measure their wattage to determine who wins.
I am not insensitive to riders getting killed but ultimately it was their choice to compete that day and whether you like it or not they died doing something they loved. Niki Lauda stopped driving at the Japanese Grand Prix in 1976 because he felt it wasn't worth the risk to his life just to win the title that year. Professional cyclists have exactly the same choice, if they don't feel happy they should sit up and ride slower and let someone else profit from their decision.
If you want to make the races safer put in measures to stop incidents like Peter Sagan getting knocked off by a motorbike during the Vuelta in 2015 or Johnny Hoogerland's catapult into barbed wire at the Tour in 2011, they were incidents that should never ever have happened and could have been avoided.
The bottom line is ... If I'm killed or injured riding my bike due to a decision I made that's okay with me. Example: I choose NOT to wear a helmet.
I'd hate to see descents neutralised or avoided altogether, Sprinters don't enjoy the mountain stages, the climbing specialists don't enjoy time trialling, the time trial specialists don't contest bunch sprints...
There are sections of each race that individual riders will shine at and other bits where they will struggle, if you want to get rid of descending as a skill for safety reasons then also get rid of bunch sprints and riding in the middle of a peloton and riding in the rain and riding when it's windy etc etc
In fact you might as well stick them all on stationary bikes and just measure their wattage to determine who wins.
I am not insensitive to riders getting killed but ultimately it was their choice to compete that day and whether you like it or not they died doing something they loved. Niki Lauda stopped driving at the Japanese Grand Prix in 1976 because he felt it wasn't worth the risk to his life just to win the title that year. Professional cyclists have exactly the same choice, if they don't feel happy they should sit up and ride slower and let someone else profit from their decision.
If you want to make the races safer put in measures to stop incidents like Peter Sagan getting knocked off by a motorbike during the Vuelta in 2015 or Johnny Hoogerland's catapult into barbed wire at the Tour in 2011, they were incidents that should never ever have happened and could have been avoided.
The bottom line is ... If I'm killed or injured riding my bike due to a decision I made that's okay with me. Example: I choose NOT to wear a helmet.
I used to go downhill very fast on a push bike. Fastest i ever clocked was 62mph on a possibly slightly inaccurate Avocet computer in the late 1980s. My friends said that i took risks, but the reality is that in my head i didn't. I didn't do the stupid things they did - i never overtook without being able to see ahead or went round a blind bend or past a road junction without scrubbing my speed in case i needed to stop. I accept though that i was lucky not to have come badly unstuck.
I can't remember which cricketer it was that said that some days when he was batting the cricket ball appeared to him like a football. I guess a lot of top pros have such perception, composure and timing that they see things more clearly and thus give themselves more time. I believe this is true of the great road bike descenders. I have occasionally experienced this sense in a much more limited way.
It is a magnificent thing to see a rider on the ragged edge descend beautifully, especially some of the non-climbers who need to make time on descents. It would be a great pity in my opinion to sanitize the sport in a way that might rule out these extraordinary efforts.
I can't remember which cricketer it was that said that some days when he was batting the cricket ball appeared to him like a football. I guess a lot of top pros have such perception, composure and timing that they see things more clearly and thus give themselves more time. I believe this is true of the great road bike descenders. I have occasionally experienced this sense in a much more limited way.
It is a magnificent thing to see a rider on the ragged edge descend beautifully, especially some of the non-climbers who need to make time on descents. It would be a great pity in my opinion to sanitize the sport in a way that might rule out these extraordinary efforts.
dorset boy
Senior Retro Guru
People with a "steady eddy" mindset just don't get it.
I used to free solo. It felt great, i was fit and aware and i wasnt going to fall. But it wasnt my job and noone knew about it. I was there for myself and have no regrets.
Joy and purity of sport, etc: i think the organizers need to find a better way. If you want a high speed descent then pad the road - cant afford to pad 40km in the alps? Then tough cookies. Theyll pad the heck out of the poggio, its just minor races/descents where officials need to lay down the rules for safety.
Issue i have is with an organization that is paying for ‘employees’ to take those risks. Theres an enticement that shouldnt be there and its a conflict of interest.
This is a huge issue in american football where young athletes get brain injuries from the position they play: cte. Ditto for boxing. Need to find a solution that preserves the sport without damaging young people.
dorset boy
Senior Retro Guru
Spartacus getting back on,enjoy 
Selective padding was done this year at the TdF:
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/to...ust-the-start-says-cpa-president-adam-hansen/
UCI also banned several "canon ball" rider positions. Much more evidence of stages cancelled or modified due to poor conditions too. These tours are so unique. Nobody pays to see them, they are a free thrilling spectator sport on many levels - equally no one wants to see a death either.
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/to...ust-the-start-says-cpa-president-adam-hansen/
UCI also banned several "canon ball" rider positions. Much more evidence of stages cancelled or modified due to poor conditions too. These tours are so unique. Nobody pays to see them, they are a free thrilling spectator sport on many levels - equally no one wants to see a death either.
