the commuting-friendly wonderfulness of tubeless ...

[greencat]

Thanks @2manyoranges - I think I was assuming that a bike which sold itself as tubeless ready (and had it written all over the rim tape, tyres and wheels (all WTB branded btw so you'd assume they'd worth together) wouldn't need anything else except a set of valves and some sealant

The way I see it, tubeless has probably already cost me a decades worth of tube repair/replacement in time wasted. I'm not sure I'd potentially sacrifice another weekend of frustration.

 

[2manyoranges]

Hmmm that’s interesting … I have a bunch of modern WTB rims and they seal up nicely usually. But haven’t used the WTB branded tape and sealant. Did you tape over the red rim tape in the rims or did you remove it? This stuff:

https://www.wtb.com/products/tcs-2-0-solid-strip
I know exactly what you mean by a waste of time and resource. Tubeless as a trend is not kind to the environment in my view. Lots of perfectly good tyres being wasted at present…we have made it environmentally OK in our stable but only with care.

 

[novocaine]

the main reason I've never transition to tubeless is the amount I ride some of my bikes the sealant will be solid and I'll have to replace it on a bike that may have only done a few hundred miles that year. my fast road bike for example only goes out in the dry during summer, it does maybe 15% of my miles a year and the hangs waiting till the next summer. if I used tubeless I'd be adding another thing to the list of commissioning that I can't be arsed doing.

the winter bike that does everything else on the other hand could maybe benefit, but I'd still carry a tube with me because I'm like that, so whats the point?

same with hardtail, it does so few miles a year these days because I rarely get offroad that it doesn't merit the effort. I did do it for one year, but was never truely happy with it.

 

[clubby]

I have just bought some Schwalbe G-ones - any experience of those?

G One Bites on the gravel bike and can’t fault them. Good off road in anything other than deep mud, but still roll nicely on the road. Over 1000 miles so far and no punctures. Rear tread has a little wear but only really noticeable because the front still looks like new.

@greencat definitely something up with the tape. Tracing it isn’t easy as the sealant can get in the rim space and come out on the opposite side from the actual leak. The time it happened to me, the bike had came set up with tubes and the valve hole just wouldn’t seal after that. Stripped the tape, put on a new layer and it was fine first time.
Takes a bit of patience but well worth it. Over 20 years on tubeless and never had an mtb puncture that even stopped me on the trail. Have heard a hiss but just kept riding and it sealed itself. Top up tyre with air when I get home. Only a road one hasn’t sealed and that was a metal staple cut, so 5mm long but thin. Was only a mile from home, so just topped up air and rode it back. Patched tyre from inside and it’s as good as new.
Only thing that wrecks tubeless tyres is sidewall cuts but terrain round here not bad for that so not an issue for me.
Don’t see how tubeless can be considered a waste of resources. Used to regularly have to bin tubes due to snakebite punctures destroying tubes to the level they couldn’t be patched. Not even an issue now. Now it’s a re-tape very occasionally and a sealant top up now and again. I also buy and swap tyres a lot less often as it is more of a pain to change, so just run a tyre until it’s worn out. Used to have a mountain of part worn tyres for various conditions and whims. Tyres may be way more expensive now, but work in a wider range of conditions than they used to, so overall I spend less (in time and money).

@novocaine , sounds like you need less bikes or to ride more. Pi$$ taking aside, sealant lasts a good amount of time. I’ve just put my winter road bike back on the road after 6 months. Can still hear plenty of sealant sloshing about in the tyre and that was last topped up at the start of last winter. I also still carry a tube just in case but the point is the only time I’ve used one in years has been to bail out other people. Benefits on road bike is debatable but it works for me. Off road it’s just a no brainier.

 

[2manyoranges]

G One Bites on the gravel bike and can’t fault them. Good off road in anything other than deep mud, but still roll nicely on the road. Over 1000 miles so far and no punctures. Rear tread has a little wear but only really noticeable because the front still looks like new.

@greencat definitely something up with the tape. Tracing it isn’t easy as the sealant can get in the rim space and come out on the opposite side from the actual leak. The time it happened to me, the bike had came set up with tubes and the valve hole just wouldn’t seal after that. Stripped the tape, put on a new layer and it was fine first time.
Takes a bit of patience but well worth it. Over 20 years on tubeless and never had an mtb puncture that even stopped me on the trail. Have heard a hiss but just kept riding and it sealed itself. Top up tyre with air when I get home. Only a road one hasn’t sealed and that was a metal staple cut, so 5mm long but thin. Was only a mile from home, so just topped up air and rode it back. Patched tyre from inside and it’s as good as new.
Only thing that wrecks tubeless tyres is sidewall cuts but terrain round here not bad for that so not an issue for me.
Don’t see how tubeless can be considered a waste of resources. Used to regularly have to bin tubes due to snakebite punctures destroying tubes to the level they couldn’t be patched. Not even an issue now. Now it’s a re-tape very occasionally and a sealant top up now and again. I also buy and swap tyres a lot less often as it is more of a pain to change, so just run a tyre until it’s worn out. Used to have a mountain of part worn tyres for various conditions and whims. Tyres may be way more expensive now, but work in a wider range of conditions than they used to, so overall I spend less (in time and money).

@novocaine , sounds like you need less bikes or to ride more. Pi$$ taking aside, sealant lasts a good amount of time. I’ve just put my winter road bike back on the road after 6 months. Can still hear plenty of sealant sloshing about in the tyre and that was last topped up at the start of last winter. I also still carry a tube just in case but the point is the only time I’ve used one in years has been to bail out other people. Benefits on road bike is debatable but it works for me. Off road it’s just a no brainier.

I have had same experience re surprising losing life of tubeless - I forgot to rotate and top up the Transition and it sat in the workshop for 12 months - quick rotate and listen and there’s plenty sloshing around in there, and no weird ‘wheel wobble’ suggesting snottage coagulant lump somewhere in the tyre…..

re resources, agree re tubes (although some of my mtb tubes in the 90s looked more patch than tube (thank you TipTop) - what I was referring to is the trend of people to adandon snotted tyres - perfectly good tread and walls - but coagulated fluid. I bought a great big pile of Spesh Butchers and Slaughters (what silly aggressive names) which had huge layer of dried tubeless fluid on them. Soaked them for two weeks and then spontex’d them - huge messy unpleasant work but saved them all. Over an hour’s scrubbing for each tyre. One was a particularly stubborn bastard. It’s that which bothers me - people not running tyres to end of working life. Other aspects of tubeless perfectly environmental - although ammonia from curing of some fluids not exactly pleasant.

 

[novocaine]

micro plastics in the sealant too apparently. bit like blame the leaves for wiggle path round the trees though really.

 

[benjabbi]

@Imlach I've had good luck on old Mavic and Bontrager rims with Stans or Joes rubber rim strips, they usually can be found cheaply, just make sure you match up the rim width.

 

[clubby]

micro plastics in the sealant too apparently. bit like blame the leaves for wiggle path round the trees though really.

Admittedly not nice stuff, but don’t think many brands include it. Amount escaping into environment must be pretty small anyway. Tyre wearing away will also deposit them into the environment over its life no matter what.

Don’t do trail centres that often anymore but can’t remember the last time I saw an inner tube discarded in a tree or at the side of a trail. Used to be a regular sight. Not sure it’s due to better behaviour as the number of gel wrappers hadn’t decreased.

 

[clubby]

A couple of years old and based on manufacturer provided information but a decent read.

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/tubeless-sealant-environmental-impact/

 

[2manyoranges]

A couple of years old and based on manufacturer provided information but a decent read.

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/tubeless-sealant-environmental-impact/

Very useful article. It looks for all the world as if that bike had been shot and brought down…..