In more batshit crazy news, Kona North American market are running a BOGOF on the new Process 
Yep, buy 1 Process get another one free
Yep, buy 1 Process get another one free
State of the industry: a running thread
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Maybe, and looking at how much 2nd hand is available, maybe we've reached peak stuff?
Guinessisgoodforyou
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How can they do that? Is there that much mark up it is good business? Amazing dealIn more batshit crazy news, Kona North American market are running a BOGOF on the new Process
Yep, buy 1 Process get another one free
Takingabreak
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Looking at the prices https://www.konaworld.com/en-eu/collections/process there has to be a huge profit margin. A kids version is priced at €2500 and the adults from €2800 to €9000.How can they do that? Is there that much mark up it is good business? Amazing deal
I just can't see how the sales and marketing people think there is demand for bikes at those prices.
Absolutely agree with this and I've mentioned this before. A visit to the likes of Gumtree produces pages upon pages of unwanted bikes. Practically spoilt for choice, and prices for complete bikes going lower and lower and making the price gap between new much bigger and bigger everyday.
A search on your all time favourite MBK brand
gives 6053 hits in the bike section, cheapest complete bikes are 0€ (give away) and the most expensive a MBK Kevlight TVT in pristine condition for 1000€ that keeps going through price reductions.29 737 hits for "electric bike"
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In more batshit crazy news, Kona North American market are running a BOGOF on the new Process
Yep, buy 1 Process get another one free
Maybe not as daft as it looks as plenty of bikes are available for 50% off and this way they get rid of two each time!
As for people spending that much on a bike, nip over to STW, there are loads of them. 0% finance makes/made it easy.
How can they do that? Is there that much mark up it is good business? Amazing deal
IIRC, Orange had the Speedwork for sale at £1100 when this was posted so your LBS can sell a bike with a £1700 RRP for £1100 and still make a small profit.
Orange probably make a similar amount selling into the LBS. BOGOF sounds amazing but the fact is that we’ve just been paying too much for stuff (not just bikes).
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well, in a previous life I was involved in manufacturing some high end equipment
So, selling Product A went like this
Manufacturing unit cost - £815
other manufacturing costs (licenses, patents etc) - |£250 or so
retailer purchase price per unit - £1700
retail - £2300 to £2900 depending on options (the retailer would make extra on each option sold)
Although the words 'price fixing' were never openly used, prices were pretty rigid and uniform over the retailers (independants and some chainstores) with discount not exact;y forbidden but not encouraged either. The dealer margin with this brand was pretty good and better than some established names at the time. Wiggle room was given knowing the customer base and how they liked to haggle - the one difference with Product A was that it was upgradeable and it could be updated via a PC which was very new in those days. So the 2nd hand market was pretty buoyant with good demand and stable pricing, not the shitshow of today with yesterdays product looking like doggy doos within 3 minutes of purchase - the Product A of 4 years previous could be made into todays with very little effort and cost.
So, selling Product A went like this
Manufacturing unit cost - £815
other manufacturing costs (licenses, patents etc) - |£250 or so
retailer purchase price per unit - £1700
retail - £2300 to £2900 depending on options (the retailer would make extra on each option sold)
Although the words 'price fixing' were never openly used, prices were pretty rigid and uniform over the retailers (independants and some chainstores) with discount not exact;y forbidden but not encouraged either. The dealer margin with this brand was pretty good and better than some established names at the time. Wiggle room was given knowing the customer base and how they liked to haggle - the one difference with Product A was that it was upgradeable and it could be updated via a PC which was very new in those days. So the 2nd hand market was pretty buoyant with good demand and stable pricing, not the shitshow of today with yesterdays product looking like doggy doos within 3 minutes of purchase - the Product A of 4 years previous could be made into todays with very little effort and cost.
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@Russell , i'm sorry i have to answer this, i hope i'm reading the tone wrong in your comment because what you said doesn't feel good from my point of view. but . . .
orange had the bikes at 1700 normal retail price, they reduced them to me, which meant i could retail them at 1300 but make a bit less than my normal-ish mark up, (note i say mark up as opposed to profit) then they sold them direct at basically what they sold them to me for, so if i price match them i make no money, zero, nothing, bugger all, sweet fanny adams.
edit, actaully no i can tell you exactly how much i make, 20 quid, the deal price to me was 900+vat, and just incase you suck at maths that means i paid 1080, so yeah if i sell them at the price Orange did then i make 20 quid, bearing in mind i build them and orange sent them out boxed to customers if you said it takes an hour to properly set it up, then i'm down maybe minus 20 quid if you said an hours labour is 40.
and this is where i get annoyed, not just with Orange undercutting shops like me but also, the average customer doesn't understand (or chooses not to understand) what the issue is, and it's this:-
IF I DON'T MAKE ANY MONEY ON THE STUFF I SELL I WON'T BE IN BUSINESS!!!
i mean is that hard to understand?
am i being an arse by making myself a living? do you begrudge anyone making money out of having a shop? do you hate tescos and amazon aswell? they love making money out of you, are Elon and Jeff people you like to see getting all the money?
your simplistic view is that it was at an inflated retail price to begin with and if i could make money selling it at 1100 then i (or Orange) was selling at a massive mark up and you think the original price is therefore a rip off, that is not the case, the truth is, they have reduced it to get a bunch of bikes gone because they need the money in the bank to pay for the stuff on order for next year, this means taking a hit on what they do have, so it's a genuine reduction to encourage a sale and it has to be a big reduction to make someone spend the money, and this is done to convert stock in to cash as quickly as possible, so they have chosen to not make money, just turn it over.
you see i have bills like everyone else, bikes shops are not charities but for some reason people always ask for discount, why? oh because it's a bartering system . . . no it's not, and what is the customer bartering with? the vague possibilty that they send their mates in? biscuits? beer? hmm don't think the tax man will accept tunnocks caramel bars and a 4 pack of fosters instead of money for the VAT bill! no, if you ask for discount the guy you're asking thinks you're a dick, it's that simple, and why? because yes, congratulations, you are a dick, 100%. now you could say well that's why people are buying mail order instead of using shops, because the shop guy treats me like a dick, well if you're being a dick then maybe it's a bit your fault and you just don't like being called out for it.
also nearly everyone coming through my door is earning more than me (because i know what i pay myself) and they are asking/demanding discount from me? i mean WTAF?! and these people will be the first to moan when the local bike shop closes down, "well he couldn't make it work, and he was ripping people off", oh you mean by charging for servicing, giving the best advice i can for free on the off chance you will buy something, selling stuff you want, committing to having 100 grands worth of stock, paying rent for a retail unit. no i'm just an evil git taking advantage
now i know that's hard to hear if you hadn't heard it before, but do you go to work for free out of the goodness of your heart, i'm guessing not.
sorry for ranting, but i frankly i felt attacked when i read that. it's dissheartening that when you are trying to do a good job at a fair price and a combination of the economic issues we have leave someone to think the little guy is a rip off merchant when Amazon made 153 billion dollars in profit in 2020, but no, i'm the problem.
orange had the bikes at 1700 normal retail price, they reduced them to me, which meant i could retail them at 1300 but make a bit less than my normal-ish mark up, (note i say mark up as opposed to profit) then they sold them direct at basically what they sold them to me for, so if i price match them i make no money, zero, nothing, bugger all, sweet fanny adams.
edit, actaully no i can tell you exactly how much i make, 20 quid, the deal price to me was 900+vat, and just incase you suck at maths that means i paid 1080, so yeah if i sell them at the price Orange did then i make 20 quid, bearing in mind i build them and orange sent them out boxed to customers if you said it takes an hour to properly set it up, then i'm down maybe minus 20 quid if you said an hours labour is 40.
and this is where i get annoyed, not just with Orange undercutting shops like me but also, the average customer doesn't understand (or chooses not to understand) what the issue is, and it's this:-
IF I DON'T MAKE ANY MONEY ON THE STUFF I SELL I WON'T BE IN BUSINESS!!!
i mean is that hard to understand?
am i being an arse by making myself a living? do you begrudge anyone making money out of having a shop? do you hate tescos and amazon aswell? they love making money out of you, are Elon and Jeff people you like to see getting all the money?your simplistic view is that it was at an inflated retail price to begin with and if i could make money selling it at 1100 then i (or Orange) was selling at a massive mark up and you think the original price is therefore a rip off, that is not the case, the truth is, they have reduced it to get a bunch of bikes gone because they need the money in the bank to pay for the stuff on order for next year, this means taking a hit on what they do have, so it's a genuine reduction to encourage a sale and it has to be a big reduction to make someone spend the money, and this is done to convert stock in to cash as quickly as possible, so they have chosen to not make money, just turn it over.
you see i have bills like everyone else, bikes shops are not charities but for some reason people always ask for discount, why? oh because it's a bartering system . . . no it's not, and what is the customer bartering with? the vague possibilty that they send their mates in? biscuits? beer? hmm don't think the tax man will accept tunnocks caramel bars and a 4 pack of fosters instead of money for the VAT bill! no, if you ask for discount the guy you're asking thinks you're a dick, it's that simple, and why? because yes, congratulations, you are a dick, 100%. now you could say well that's why people are buying mail order instead of using shops, because the shop guy treats me like a dick, well if you're being a dick then maybe it's a bit your fault and you just don't like being called out for it.
also nearly everyone coming through my door is earning more than me (because i know what i pay myself) and they are asking/demanding discount from me? i mean WTAF?! and these people will be the first to moan when the local bike shop closes down, "well he couldn't make it work, and he was ripping people off", oh you mean by charging for servicing, giving the best advice i can for free on the off chance you will buy something, selling stuff you want, committing to having 100 grands worth of stock, paying rent for a retail unit. no i'm just an evil git taking advantage
now i know that's hard to hear if you hadn't heard it before, but do you go to work for free out of the goodness of your heart, i'm guessing not.
sorry for ranting, but i frankly i felt attacked when i read that. it's dissheartening that when you are trying to do a good job at a fair price and a combination of the economic issues we have leave someone to think the little guy is a rip off merchant when Amazon made 153 billion dollars in profit in 2020, but no, i'm the problem.
I made no comment and offered no opinion, merely requoted your post as an example as to how Kona can offer a BOGOF.
Kona can offer a BOGOF because the cost price of a bike is less than half RRP, the same as Orange and most other non-direct to consumer retail models.
I’m sorry you took that as a personal attack.
Kona can offer a BOGOF because the cost price of a bike is less than half RRP, the same as Orange and most other non-direct to consumer retail models.
I’m sorry you took that as a personal attack.
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