Shill bidding?

[gibbleking]

they do tend to get quite high prices ..xt shifters that is....i have a set of 8sp rapid fires that im thinking of selling as i know they will fetch a good price.the sxtrc shifters do well too...

 

[jonnyboy666]

Wow, all these "ethical" shill bidders, willing to bid items up to a notional reserve, but no further, oh no..... :roll

Its wrong and its illegal. Don't want to pay £2 or £3 quid to set a reserve on ebay, don't like ebays fee structure ? - simple. Don't use ebay. Go back to the card in the newsagents window.

i didn't say i agreed with it or that i do it, was just making the point that in the case described above it wasn't much different to setting a reserve.

 

[1duck]

I don't condone shill bidding but go to a live auction and it happens all the time - auctooneers bouncing bids off the wall

Yeah magic bids in a book no one else can see, bids picked out of the air then using their 'discretion' and deciding not to sell the item.


As for the whole argument if you don't like ebays fee structure...no i don't like their fee structure, i also don't like the fact they are allowed to force you to use their payment system to grift you for another 5%

If it happened in the real world the monopoly commission would have stepped in years ago, if someone stiffs ebay a couple of quid i'm more than happy to buy from them. Penny listing with 200 quid shipping on a bike? yeah i'll buy it...so long as he is clear about it in the advert.

 

[Russell]

Hold on... there is a huge difference between setting a reserve and shill bidding up to a minimum.

Im starting to understand why retro prices have rocketed now, apparently its ok to illegally, artificially inflate prices on your mates auctions!

At least this thread is informative, i now know whose ebay auctions to steer clear of.

 

[marky2484]

+1 :roll:

 

[1duck]

Hold on... there is a huge difference between setting a reserve and shill bidding up to a minimum.

Im starting to understand why retro prices have rocketed now, apparently its ok to illegally, artificially inflate prices on your mates auctions!

At least this thread is informative, i now know whose ebay auctions to steer clear of.

I havent sold anything on ebay in years, since about the time when they bought gumtree...but i am saying i have no problem buying from someone who has shill bidded something up to what they consider their reserve.

I doubt its really affected prices because if i see an item at 50 pounds that has been shill bid up to what someone considers their reserve but i value the item at say 35 i'm not going to bid 51...

The only thing that has effected retro prices is people of a certain age coming into wages that allow them to spend on things they couldn't afford in the past, its basically all caused by a wave of mid life crisis amongst a generation...plus the new stuff doesn't seem as good as the old stuff in most cases.

I can afford to have the bike with the equipment i wanted when i was younger but i couldn't afford to have...i can even afford to pay a slight premium for the right components. Anyway if i do have things to sell they tend to get sold on here, sure i might get less cash than on ebay but i don't get bled for 15%

 

[Whatleymeister]

Hold on... there is a huge difference between setting a reserve and shill bidding up to a minimum.

^ this.

While I can see the logic behind only shill bidding up to an equivalent reserve amount, if I am honest, I personally don't agree with it.

The item wouldn't reflect the genuine second hand value, as previously mentioned. If a reserve of, say £50, was put on an item and didn't sell, then you know the market value isn't £50 and pay no seller fees other than listing. If you shill bid up to £50, it (more than likely) falsifies the second hand value and potentially leaves the seller with the sale fees to pay and no genuine buyer as (s)he shilled themselves to high. Mind, the seller could always say that the winning bid was a non-payer, but dodgy second accounts can only take so much non-payer feedback before being investigated, so that is a whole seperate palaver.

This all then adds up when you consider the other threads about people claiming to have never received items from honest sellers, even with recorded delivery. It doesn't really paint a pretty picture of trading online.

Not trying to rattle cages wth this, just my opinion of it.

 

[chiswickcollectables]

What's wrong with starting the bidding at the min price you want for the item?

 

[1duck]

What's wrong with starting the bidding at the min price you want for the item?

you pay more unless its a free listing day, but yes thats the sensible thing to do. If you wanted to list something at say 30 pounds it would be a pound cheaper to list it at 99p then shill bid it up to 30 pounds...hence getting the free listing whilst still getting the starting price you wanted.

Category
Starting price Insertion fee
£0.01 - £0.99 Free *
£1.00 - £4.99 £0.15
£5.00 - £14.99 £0.25
£15.00 - £29.99 £0.50
£30 - £99.99 £1

Ebay still get paid the final value fee and their paypal fee assuming someone pays with paypal which is fair enough.

 

[Neil]

What's wrong with starting the bidding at the min price you want for the item?

Nothing.

People don't, though, because guides on ebay selling, tell people that starting items at real low prices (say 99p) encourages the most interest and likelihood of bidding.

To a certain degree, same is true with reserves.

All comes down to that stupid phrase about having your cake and eating it - I mean what is the point about having cake and not being able to eat it?