Paypal f&f, Bank transfers & a seller unknown to you.

[Jimmy oldskool]

I buy lots of stuff on here, some at high value and tend to stick to sellers I know, know of or have a good standing on the forum so f&f is no real risk. If it's something I really want and I don't know the seller, I'll do a big of digging on their profile to gauge them or just pay the fees.

I also try and pay straight away...literally as soon as the deal has been agreed so that I can put confidence in the seller as that pays off in the long run too I think.

 

[Ren Rawbor]

I must have been living in a pink cloud all this time cause I never bought anything (here, on the german forum on FB groups and on the german classified ads) with PayPal buyers protection and always got the item just fine.

I did however do my due dilligence beforehands on all buyers to make sure they were legit.

I think that saved me but still I must have been lucky more than a few times.

Same here, if I'm perfectly honest I once sent £300 via bank transfer to a new member who'd joined days ago and their only postings were the ad for the bike they were selling. Not that I just sent the cash & hail mary'd it, I did speak with the seller and made some checks etc & was satisfied they were genuine.

Most intentional scams are easy to spot IMO, although that doesn't preclude an otherwise genuine seller falling victim to greed/desperation or even accident that prevents them sending the item once the money lands & they have effectively all the cards. By and large though it seems to me that folks who are actually into building/riding/saving retro bikes because that's what they cut (and smashed!!!) their teeth on, are more trustworthy than the general population as a whole. I think it has to do with the camaraderie we all built from BITD

Now I've done my misty-eyed thing though, that's potentially a stupid mistake and if there's ANY doubt in your mind, even a "nah, that's silly" doubt then either protect yourself or leave the risk to the next person.

 

[bikeworkshop]

Its not the end of the world though if you lose money to a minor scam. If you're buying fancy old bike bits, you can probably afford food on the table and should've paid the rent already.

Now, when does the bookie open, there's a great horse running today this bloke i met told me so.

 

[Ren Rawbor]

The difference between that kind of gambling and this though, is that with our type we can influence the odds to a large degree But yeh I agree, it's not like we've just transferred our life savings to release our Nigerian inheritance from the lawyer's offices

 

[bikeworkshop]

And there's an element of gambling to vintage purchases anyway.

My best buys were enamel signs in the 90s, seemed expensive at 50-60£ but I bought them to decorate the shop.
Now many are worth £400+
I believe this is due to the exponential growth of "mancaves".

On the other hand, an immaculate kirk revolution, or itera, strida, worth less now than 25 years ago.
Even a Roberts white spider hasn't even kept pace with inflation in that time period.

The wise collector will probably wait till next year

 

[KermitGKona88]

At the end of the day a genuine seller won't get upset if you cover the fees.

 

[kingoffootball]

At the end of the day a genuine seller won't get upset if you cover the fees.

Of course not, if you are a genuine buyer. However, as joglo pointed out buyers can use this to try to exploit the protection offered.

 

[thegrouch]

A slightly different view, I’ve had my PP account permanently deactivated after an almost 2 year dispute over an eBay sale went bad. Violation of their “community standards” apparently, when the item I sold was completely falsely made out to be not as described.
The only way I can now send or receive money from here, eBay, etc is via bank transfer.
I absolutely get why people wouldn’t be willing to deal like this but with zero chance of getting my PP back, it can be very difficult as a genuine buyer/seller. Luckily there are trusting people on these sites that are prepared to work with me.

 

[Betsy]

A friend of mine bought a 1986 World Cup football when he was a kid.. never pumped it up and saved it for 30yrs.. eventually he sold it on eBay, (similar to the above) the buyer complained, said it didn't fit the description and returned it.. he returned a cabbage in a box and kept the football, eBay backed the buyer all the way, my friend was gutted!

In a similar instance, my sis in' law lives in the diamond district of Antwerp, she trades high value jewelry and watches as a side hustle, the lower value goods, she sells on eBay.. she had a similar issue with a sale, the buyer claimed it didn't fit the description, she asked for photos, then phoned the police and reported eBay and the buyer for fraud, she got a crime number and eBay instantly backed down.

 

[bikeworkshop]

Scammers aren't usually interested in the item itself - just the resale value and market size.
(The guy with the stolen credit card was always in a hurry to buy the most expensive bike in the shop, even if it didn't fit him)

That probably makes the world cup football a greater risk than an m900 groupset.
So that in turn makes a bike collectors market safer than "average"
- but haven't we all met at least one collector who gets a thrill out of ripping people off, buying or selling?