On balance, I still am not a fan of e-bikes (previously known as ‘I just don’t get E bikes’)

Madmax1993 said:
I don't necessarily favour the current limit, that's just what the law is currently in the UK. I do agree with the spirit that an ebike should still be, at its core, a bicycle first. This allows it to integrate on cycle paths, and with mainstream bikes. Personally, I would like to see the assistance limit go up to 20mph or so, as this is close to what a moderately fit cyclist could achieve and sustain on a road bike on a cycle path. Any more however, and it starts to get hairy if the user is not skilled (read trained) to handle the machine they're using.

I have nothing against the existence of low(ish) powered electric mopeds either, but I feel they should require registration and insurance, and should not be allowed on cycle or footpaths, as the greater speed they are capable of makes them dangerous to other path users. I think I'm saying the same as a lot of others are really, but I also stand by my point that the type of hooligans riding derestricted ebikes and/or electric mopeds in an irresponsible fashion are not going to be deterred by attempting to integrate surrons or ebikes with other powered transport. Greater policing/enforcement is required to stop this kind of behaviour.

There are a few target audiences for ebikes:
Firstly, making cycling accessible to those who otherwise couldn't/wouldn't participate. Either unfit, elderly or disabled people, for example. This is where pedal assist ebikes shine.
Secondly, as an alternative to combustion engine travel. This is where non-cyclists are tempted out of cars by ebikes or electric mopeds. The example is, 'you don't need to put on silly lycra or arrive all sweaty, as the bike helps you out.' Or an electric cargo bike having the space to transport luggage that a normal bike couldn't. Or an electric moped could beat the traffic without you having to exercise at all.
Thirdly, for the mountain bikers, ebikes can be an alternative to uplift days, or just generally be a way to get more runs in in a day by taking the edge off the climbs.
Click to expand...
Gosh a lot in there. I agree absolutely with your ‘enforcement’ imperative - a lot of dangerous nonsense could be stopped simply by enforcement of existing laws...and yet I fear that the latest crime-triage processes adopted by police will mean that anarchy on electric-assisted vehicles will continue in perpetuity.

As a part Downhiller and with a DH Grom of high skill, I do feel a hypocrit, since we use lift uplift in the Alps a lot. And who knows if the electricity for running the lifts comes from renewable sources or from burning kittens or such. But even so, this feels different from using an e-bike in the wild when one could just as easily be using a Normal Bike. The ever-giving USA Land of the Free of course has some of the most restrictive wilderness regulation in the world, and it IS enforced, most often:

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/...ervice, Bureau of Land,use are open to eMTBs.
which simply means no e-bikes, even for the more elderly mountain-bike who might eventually use an e-bike or otherwise not get out at all…

Oh this is all so HARD….and very difficult to invoke or establish principle.

Here goes

Principle 1 if you would just be a wee bit slower, then use a Normal Bike
Principle 2 if it’s simply just a bit easier on an e-bike, then use a Normal Bike
Principle 3 if you REALLY CAN‘T use a Normal Bike due to infirmity or injury, then use an e-bike
Principle 4 if you would otherwise be using a car for the journey, then use an e-bike
Principle 5 if you are not sure about any of these boundaries, then use a Normal Bike

In hearing that we are certainly will miss the 1.5 deg C target, I still have deep misgivings about the additional resources needed in e-bikes.…as I outlined in earlier posts….
 
People want the juice without the squeeze.

I’d also add that riding a bike normal bike a few times a week would drastically increase people’s fitness and likely lifespan.

Spend any time in mainland Europe and compare our average person to theirs and you’ll see a huge difference in fitness/weight/health.

Soon that 5 mile slog will be a 5 mile breeze. Then 10 miles and so on. It a process to get fit and unfortunately people sometimes want to bypas the work involved but also don’t understand how fast they would see benefits as many give up too early and want to take the easy route.
 
I’ve seen a decline in E bike usage where I am. It’s been replaced by those E-scooters (Either bought or rented). What’s paradoxal though, not too long ago, I was being socially pressured to « switch my lights off » « nuclear energy is dangerous » save the environment etc etc. Now my city, which by the way has a green council, is filled with obese (no offense to the overweight), twig legged young people riding those things.
Sure- they are greener than polluting cars and take up less room, but from observation and from a few studies I’ve read. Pedal assisted 2 wheels have had very little impact on reducing car usage within cities. Typically those using - e bikes - E scooters were once using public transport, walking and well…bikes (often recycled bikes too).
To conclude - Most people prefer confort and the easy way. A chunk of the populace, don’t care about the environment. Most users don’t need assistance, they are perfectly healthy.
When I see some disgarded on the floor on a bike path, I often sling em out the way (unfortunately, some accidentely fall into the nearby river).
 
I actually ride at 18-20mph on bike paths. If there's a big headwind I might be "towing" a cyclist behind me. But if I'm in the road with traffic (which I avoid as much as possible) then our legal limit of 27mph is useful. On sidewalks when there are pedestrians I turn the assist off, and sometimes even walk the bike. I've installed a 40t low cassette just for that purpose. The extra power makes the bike more versatile.

As far as the illegal ration of power, it has saved my life from the lawless drivers that are common here. I'm missing 1 foot of my back fender because a driver decided to back up at full speed while I was crossing behind him. I saw the backup lights come on and hit the throttle, and the 130db air horn together. I put a foot down just past his bumper and he pushed the rear wheel sideways shoving the fender stays into the spokes. The DH rated wheel was only slightly tweaked. The drunken illegal immigrant witnesses thought it was funny. The guy saw me and took off down the street in reverse. We only have rear license plates here. So you can have all the theories, rules, and excuses you like. A real Ebike can lift the front wheel with every pedal stroke from a stop light. That's how you know you have enough power.
I'm pretty sure the average fit rider couldn't do that.
 
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...and today I had a nice day going nowhere, reading, listening to the radio and fettling in the workshop. To meet the carbon reduction targets we need to meet: going nowhere or going locally (preferably on a non e-bike) is going to have to be far more common...
 
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An interesting ride home tonight. Coming down an overpass i saw the light of a vehicle catching up to me. I wasn't in a hurry but I was going downhill at about 20mph. Due to somw cross traffic it was a while before I could see what it was. A young guy about 20 years old on one of those 1 wheel between the ankles devices. Not the fat tireed ones I guess about 16x1.75" tire. On a straight run my Ebike was a bit faster but not by much. I could have put it in top gear and pedaled to get more, but I'd just had dinner, and it wasn't really the right place to go faster. When we got to an enclosed bike path I let him get ahead since running together didn't seem the safest thing. I'm guessing he was good for about 26mph, with no brakes or transmission. No helmet ,gloves, knee pads., just his street clothes.
Most people I've seen riding those have full protective gear. This is the only time I've encountered one outside of the city traveling between towns.
 
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