Not an Orange Clockwork. Or is it?

[redefined_cycles]

Hi guys,

Just been out on the trail today on the (what I thought was a Clockwork) and during the ride I met my Bike-Mechanic teacher whom I've not seen in while. I asked if he could shed some more light on my frame and after a quick look he seemed to think it may be a Ritchey frame (or another frame designer of which I forgot the name) due to the Ritchey dropouts.

After coming home this evening, due to my conversation with him I thought I'd do a little google-digging. It seems that the Ritchey stays were used on a number of retro-frames including Salsa and Bontrager. It doesn't look like a Ritchey frame!

If anyone can shed some light then it'd be most welcome. Pics of my frame can be seen in my gallery under the heading of Orange Clockwork.

Additional info I can provide :

It is a 28.6 seat tube.
Ritchey dropouts
No gussets under the headtube (so it's most likely not a Salsa)
Integrated seatpin
Definitely steel (as you can see from the supercomfy ride which feels like my old Orange P7)
Seat stays say on them- X-clusive wishbone stays
Integrated mech hanger
1 and 1/8th inch steerer tube
Frame number: S95128904
Bent chain and seatstays and looks like it'll take upto 2.25 wheels although currently running 2.1 kenda Nevegal

Once again, thanks very much for your help in this matter and if anyone can help it'd be greatly appreciated

PS. One of the main reasons why I'd originally thought it was a Clockwork (as well as the fact someone had labelled it scruffily as such) was because of the way the stays leave the seattube...

 

[Dossa]

Not a Clockwork for me....

 

[totti]

No, pretty sure that ain't a Clockwork, or even an Orange for that matter.

 

[matthew71]

loads off bikes use ritchey lugs, they where good quality and used by plenty off frame builders. but with a picture it,s just a guessing game

 

[Anthony]

It definitely isn't an Orange, but it looks quite like a Rock Lobster. The serial number just tells us that it was made in Taiwan in December 1995 by a factory whose name begins with S. I'm afraid I don't know who the S maker was/is, but all the factories made frames for a range of different brands and there is very rarely anything in the serial number to identify the brand.

If it was a Rock Lobster, it would be one of the earlier ones, before Merlin started selling them in early 98. There are some threads on here about the earlier Rock Lobsters if you care to search and compare.

 

[Tazio]

It definitely isn't an Orange, but it looks quite like a Rock Lobster. The serial number just tells us that it was made in Taiwan in December 1995 by a factory whose name begins with S. I'm afraid I don't know who the S maker was/is, but all the factories made frames for a range of different brands and there is very rarely anything in the serial number to identify the brand.

If it was a Rock Lobster, it would be one of the earlier ones, before Merlin started selling them in early 98. There are some threads on here about the earlier Rock Lobsters if you care to search and compare.

I wouldn't dare to question your huge knowledge but didn't all the pre- Merlin Lobsters have the cables on the side of the top tube?

 

[Anthony]

I wouldn't dare to question your huge knowledge but didn't all the pre- Merlin Lobsters have the cables on the side of the top tube?

I'm not sure about 'all' (and still less about 'huge'!) Certainly this 96 frame is a different shape than the 94 NTi Rock Lobsters, and has different cable routing and no canti hanger. It actually looks just like a 98/99 RL 853, but it can't be because of the serial number. I haven't got a picture of the 96 version, but I think there were some and I was just speculating really that this might be one such.

 

[hirosawa]

What Anthony said, really. Don't want to dash your hopes but those Ritchey dropouts were used on loads of frames, so don't get too excited about it being something special like a Salsa or a Bonty.

 

[redefined_cycles]

Hi guys. Thanks for all the input so far. Hirosawa, I know what you're saying and don't worry about my hopes getting dashed about it not being a Salsa or a Bonty. All I know is that it's one of the best that I've had so far (been through many of the top rated rides such as P7, Maxlight, Zaskar (pre 2000), etc- all hand built with top parts and corrected for geometry) and this being better than them just makes me wonder.

Just been looking at some of the earlier Rock Lobsters and I doubt if this is one of them as it doesn't have gussets around the top tube junctions.

If anyone thinks it'll be of use I can post more pics of specifics sections of the bike onto my gallery. Just let me know what pics will help.

The thing that's confusing is the bent chain and seatstays. I can't find anything that had such stays. It's a top pull front mech by the way.

Once again, thanks for all the input and either way, it's a fantastic ride. Knowing what it is would be a bonus and maybe influence my next build.

PS. Rebuilding a 2003 Cannondale F800 for my mate at the mo... What I can say about Cannons build quality is that it's top notch. He's never had cranks/bottom bracket/pedals removed but they all came out a breeze (bar the BB for which I'm awaiting a new 8 notch BB tool)

 

[MikeD]

I've got a late 90s Muddy Fox that has a lot of features in common with that -- wishbone, curved stays, extended seat tube with front slot, Ritchey dropouts etc.