Late 40s / Early 50s René Herse tip find

[Jonny69]

Some bits I’ve been reading, that I stumbled across via this Velo Orange article from 2007: https://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2007/01/maxi-car-hubs.html?m=1

This René Herse Concourse has quite similar bits to mine: https://www.ebykr.com/tech-specs-1951-rene-herse/

Some bits on the Maxi Car hubs. Some history and shots of the various models: https://www.ebykr.com/maxi-car-history-image-gallery/

And a cool story. I want to be more Sid! https://www.ebykr.com/maxi-car-old-roller/

I do like the way most pieces about René Herse, Singer etc are written like a Rouleur article!

 

[Woz]

The notorious @Guinessisgoodforyou thread was a big eye opener for me. We've been so drip and breast fed bamboozled that it is / was the racing sphere and trickle down technology that led to the bikes we know today. Reality is it is not entirely true when you delve in the thread.

The Randonneur movement that essentially could still sort of exist in war time, did lead to lone builders building up and giving us early designs to brake efficiently, change wide ratio 4 x 2 gearing, start with wittled down designs to keep weight down etc. There is no doubt historically and factually while the TdF was held by weird self sufficient regulations etc. and no racing at all, it was the Randonneur movement that became a spear head. Material advances making a big difference of course.

I only learned a while back the definition of "Criterium" which you see on the those early Mavic rims. Criterium is defined as an event with no equivalent in a World Championship competition - hence things like Col (Mountain passes) challenges, Audax, etc. I'm not at all saying serious touring was competitive, but for sure amongst serious bike constructers there was a serious crowd willing to purchase their goods; and post war peace time this would have exploded in popularity in new found freedoms after occupation.

Roughly, what ...... from early 1950s to say early 1980s the material and know how just got refined with very little major change till about mid-80s, with perhaps the clipless pedal from Look and early carbon tubes from TVT etc. On a consumer goods level, essentially the same thing went to 2000 more-or-less.

 

[Imwit]

Loving this thread, your work on the build and the stories around it.

I think that Jan Heine of Rene Herse Cycles has the build books from the original business. If so, he should be able to tell you when it was built with the details you now have.

 

[dirttorpedo]

The notorious @Guinessisgoodforyou thread was a big eye opener for me. We've been so drip and breast fed bamboozled that it is / was the racing sphere and trickle down technology that led to the bikes we know today. Reality is it is not entirely true when you delve in the thread.

The Randonneur movement that essentially could still sort of exist in war time, did lead to lone builders building up and giving us early designs to brake efficiently, change wide ratio 4 x 2 gearing, start with wittled down designs to keep weight down etc. There is no doubt historically and factually while the TdF was held by weird self sufficient regulations etc. and no racing at all, it was the Randonneur movement that became a spear head. Material advances making a big difference of course.

I only learned a while back the definition of "Criterium" which you see on the those early Mavic rims. Criterium is defined as an event with no equivalent in a World Championship competition - hence things like Col (Mountain passes) challenges, Audax, etc. I'm not at all saying serious touring was competitive, but for sure amongst serious bike constructers there was a serious crowd willing to purchase their goods; and post war peace time this would have exploded in popularity in new found freedoms after occupation.

Roughly, what ...... from early 1950s to say early 1980s the material and know how just got refined with very little major change till about mid-80s, with perhaps the clipless pedal from Look and early carbon tubes from TVT etc. On a consumer goods level, essentially the same thing went to 2000 more-or-less.

The more I learn about French post war cycling culture, the more I find it frustrating that French technological leadership in cyclotouring and non-competitive cycling is rarely recognized these days. If the Japanese had decided to adopt French bicycle standards rather than British we'd probably be looking askance at old British bikes and having similar discussions about the challenges of restoring old Hetchins.

 

[dirttorpedo]

Loving this thread, your work on the build and the stories around it.

I think that Jan Heine of Rene Herse Cycles has the build books from the original business. If so, he should be able to tell you when it was built with the details you now have.

That would be cool.

 

[Jonny69]

It’s been a while, but I got some spanner time today and it’s getting close to being rideable. More a bit later…

 

[Jonny69]

So, rebuild time. There are a couple of things that need addressing, but I can basically start putting this back together and get it riding.

I hadn’t done the bottom bracket round at the garage because I didn’t want to lose any balls or fill it with grit while rebuilding. Round at the house was much safer.



The balls measure a little over 6.3mm, so I’m calling them 6.35mm or 1/4”. 11 each side. I’ve re-used them but they’re a bit pitted and want replacing ideally.



Non-drive side cup was fairly straightforward. Drive side I did with the fixed cup in-situ, so needed a bit more patience with a set of long laboratory tweezers:

I'm very very surprised at the seat-post diameter. Seat-tubes have been fairly standard at 28mm OD - a seat-post with a diameter of 26.2mm usually indicates a lightweight frame, and 25mm errr ..... not lightweight

I’m 99% certain now that the seatpost clamp is pinched closed and it should have a bigger diameter seatpost. So if 26.2mm is what it should have, I’ll keep an eye out for one. Then I can ease the clamp open to where it should be and lightly ream it back to round and the correct size.

The Mafac cantis don’t fit, which is annoying, but I think I’ve got a plan. They’re thicker than the RH cantis so the original sleeved mounting bolts aren’t long enough. They also don’t quite go over them, so I think the bore in the Mafac cantis might be 5/16” (=7.94mm) while the RH ones are 8mm. The fix will be to use some M6 shoulder bolts with an 8mm x 16mm shoulder, then just run an 8mm reamer through the Mafac cantis.

Then I’ll need to get that stuck screw out the rear bridge. I’ve got some nice Dormer easy-outs that ought to do the trick. I’ll drill a 3mm hole down the broken bit of screw and hopefully it’ll come out. I’m also hoping it’s M5 so a replacement will be straightforward. Then I can put the rear mudguard back on.

That just leaves the Cyclo rear mech. It’s very worn at the pivot, probably too worn to operate properly and I fear it might actually break through. I haven’t quite worked out what I’m going to do here, but it’ll involve opening up the bore and either lightly pressing in or bonding in a brass ring. In the meantime I’ll probably ride it single speed while I deal with that.

 

[Imwit]

Is there any possibility of re using the original chainrings?
Are they a proprietary BCD?

 

[Jonny69]

Is there any possibility of re using the original chainrings?
Are they a proprietary BCD?

Not on these cranks because the originals are 3 bolt and Stronglights are 5.

 

[Imwit]

Are there other cranks than RH that they will fit?

Stronglight 3 arm cranks seem to be too big, 116 BCD from what I can see.