I.D. Cards; Should They Be Mandatory?

[Twister]

Re:

I support ID badges for mayhem but only if they have real and forum names.

 

[The History Man]

Re: Re:

I support ID badges for mayhem but only if they have real and forum names.

But would they be compulsory?

 

[Bats]

Re: Re:

Lots of things are factually true. People crash their cars in fatal accidents. Some even use them as weapons. True. But we don't tell people not to drive or ban vehicles. For 99% of drivers it's not an issue. If you drive safely and do nothing wrong etc....

The same applies to suspicious or illegal behaviour. I'm not likely to get rendered down as I've not been up to much lately. If i had I should hopefully be worried. I'll wager that your audience on here is similar, so stop trying to extrapolate such measures from a discussion about being able to be identified easily and appropriately. Absolutely ridiculous to do so.

And before you go on about innocents being trampled under the ....etc Don't bother. Had that discussion many times and for real concerning real people, making real decisions. Not on a bicycle forum. I bet mistakes continue to be made, rights abused. But proportionally when compared to and balanced agianst the behaviour of others seeking to harm our citizens, I'll live with it.

Weird that you plagerize my opinions on the Stasi in order to defend the empire instead. anyway, you probably should have read point 3

3) you're too boring for them to bother kidnapping you

 

[The History Man]

I'm off to buy shares in Bacofoil.

You still seek to polarize this argument with histrionics rather than place it in a modern context. I'm not sure mentioning the Stasi and the Empire present you as a modern world rational thinker.

More so a complete fruitbat.

 

[ajm]

When you go on holiday within the eu, do you have a European Health Insurance Card (EHIC) and do you carry it around with you the entire time? If you do, do you carry a wallet around with you with your driving licence with you? both maybe asked for by some government official overseas at some point.

Personally I have no intention on going on holiday in any other country in the EU, none of them really appeal to me as a holiday destination.

You're talking about something totally different from day-to-day life though - when I'm on holiday I am more willing to tolerate other people's inconvenient and unpleasant regulations as I'm merely a guest in their country. At home, I don't see why I should be treated like an inmate in a giant concentration camp. This is my homeland, and if I'm not endangering anyone I should be left in peace to come and go as I please.

 

[Bats]

I'm off to buy shares in Bacofoil.

You still seek to polarize this argument with histrionics rather than place it in a modern context. I'm not sure mentioning the Stasi and the Empire present you as a modern world rational thinker.

More so a complete fruitbat.

I am putting it in a modern context; I'm literally talking about things that exist today. That things they do today.

When I mention the Stasi I do it, as I already pointed out, to show that you endorse the western equivalents for the same reason I'd endorse the now sadly defunct eastern ones. You make the same point I'd make. I didn't think it was a difficult point to grasp.

When I say the word empire, I was hoping you'd have an understanding of the concept of imperialism. An actual understanding, things like power disparities between countries, continued economic domination of former colones, coups etc. At home it protects itself also.

If the word for you just means the song "rule Britannia" or those funny red coats on soldiers in the film "zulu" then it's a waste of breath I suppose.

Still, it's very entertaining to see a self described "history man" make cracks about tinfoil when someone mentions things that have been out in the open for decades and are now a matter of public record.

I mean, what other publicly known facts do you dispute? Heliocentrism?

 

[KDM]

You're talking about something totally different from day-to-day life though - when I'm on holiday I am more willing to tolerate other people's inconvenient and unpleasant regulations as I'm merely a guest in their country.

My point was that you are indeed open to the idea of carrying around some form of id if requested too. Your only variance seems to be what countries officials are asking you to produce, which explains your ability to over dramatise which leads me onto,

I don't see why I should be treated like an inmate in a giant concentration camp.

Having visited Auschwitz, I doubt we have the same definition of a concentration camp

 

[The History Man]

I'm off to buy shares in Bacofoil.

You still seek to polarize this argument with histrionics rather than place it in a modern context. I'm not sure mentioning the Stasi and the Empire present you as a modern world rational thinker.

More so a complete fruitbat.

I am putting it in a modern context; I'm literally talking about things that exist today. That things they do today.

When I mention the Stasi I do it, as I already pointed out, to show that you endorse the western equivalents for the same reason I'd endorse the now sadly defunct eastern ones. You make the same point I'd make. I didn't think it was a difficult point to grasp.

When I say the word empire, I was hoping you'd have an understanding of the concept of imperialism. An actual understanding, things like power disparities between countries, continued economic domination of former colones, coups etc. At home it protects itself also.

If the word for you just means the song "rule Britannia" or those funny red coats on soldiers in the film "zulu" then it's a waste of breath I suppose.

Still, it's very entertaining to see a self described "history man" make cracks about tinfoil when someone mentions things that have been out in the open for decades and are now a matter of public record.

I mean, what other publicly known facts do you dispute? Heliocentrism?

Show me where I dispute anything factual you've written. I merely questioned the hyperbolic use and context in relation to the issue of ID cards in 2017

I haven't supported either extreme view my interpretation of your comments suggests you assume all must subscribe to. Shall we all remove our number plates as well? Do grow up. You can't think that whining about a few infringements of civil liberties is going to change a thing in the wider global context in which these 'illegal' and sanctioned activities sit. How naive.

I'm done. Off to pull out some fingernails.

As for Heliocentism, I don't believe anything I read in the Sun.

 

[Bats]

Show me where I dispute anything factual you've written. I merely questioned the hyperbolic use and context in relation to the issue of ID cards in 2017

I haven't supported either extreme view my interpretation of your comments suggests you assume all must subscribe to. Shall we all remove our number plates as well? Do grow up. You can't think that whining about a few infringements of civil liberties is going to change a thing in the wider global context in which these 'illegal' and sanctioned activities sit. How naive.

I'm done. Off to pull out some fingernails.

As for Heliocentism, I don't believe anything I read in the Sun.

In my last reply to you I already had to explain what I said because you didn't understand it. Now you don't understand that post either, because you're reading strange things into it that contradict what I actually wrote.

An example, your remarks about "removing numberplates". Why would you suggest it, when I have repeatedly pointed out that the government's malice isn't taken out on boring ordinary people?


What I have been saying, over and over again, is that fear of ID cards leading to totalitarianism is silly. Because under totalitarianism, the government butchers leave normal people alone. Because we are boring and not a threat. Boring, harmless people like us have nothing to fear, nothing to be afraid of. Only people who actually pose a challenge do. We know that because the totalitarianism is already here.

Your spelling and punctuation is fine so I assume your reading problem is laziness rather than inability.

 

[Raging_Bulls]

The problem with using a bank card or phone as ID is that there is no guarantee that the person holding the card is the one whose name is on it.

Over here having and carrying an ID card has been mandatory since ... well ... no idea. All my life basically. Probably before that too.
I need to show my ID when dealing with the government, use it to identify myself at hospitals etc (it has a chip, so we just insert it into a reader like you would a bank card) ... but apart from that I've never used it. As long as you don't draw their attention, the police will not just stop you and ask you to identify yourself. Wrap it in tin foil or put it in an RFID-blocking wallet if you're worried about tracking the RFID chip (if it has one, that is).

It's not that I don't care about my privacy, on the contrary I am very worried about mine in particular and the way it is reduced in the UK in general. Somebody really needs to tell Theresa May (and the rest of your politicians) that Nineteen Eighty Four was a warning, not a manual.

Collecting everyone's communication hasn't helped prevent a single attack. Most of the time the attacker was known to the intelligence community and either was on a watchlist or had been on one, but they didn't see it coming anyway. (or maybe they did and they let it happen on purpose, but that's a whole other conspiracy theory). If the haystack is so big that you fail to see the needles, adding more hay isn't going to help.

Attempting to ban encryption is just idiotic. It'll give the government (and malicious actors) easy insight in the communications of law-abiding citizens, but criminals and terrorists will resort to non-regulated apps and tools to communicate in secret. The crypto rabbit is out of the hat, it's not going to go away no matter how much May would like to control and regulate everyone's life.

Seriously, with the whole Investigatory Powers Act and all the stuff that GCHQ is already doing, ID cards are the least of your concern when it comes to privacy or civil liberties.