another mystery frame

[petewo]

Hi,
I bought this frame and fork on Gumtree a few months ago and built it up from the spares bin. I am pretty certain it is not a Scapin but what is it?
TIG welded steel, the welding at the headtube looks a bit rough, oversized tubing, looks very much like Thron, there was a Thron sticker on the (unicrown) fork, no rifling in tubes
27.0 seatpost
no serial number, markings, pantos
very short head tube for a 51x53 frame
single bottle cage brazing only

Weighs approx 8.4kg as pictured and rides really nicely so its a keeper

Grateful for any info that helps me identify it

thanks

Peter

 

[foz]

Why do you think it's not a Scapin? the colours and paint design are typical Scapin, and I can't imagine anyone rebadging something else as one (not that they're bad, just that most rebadged frames use something a bit "better"; colnago, de rosa, gios, pinarello... etc)

 

[petewo]

Hi
thanks for the response
I agree re why bother rebadging but a few things don't seem right;
seat post has a brazed on collar
straight/horizontal seat stay bridge, they're usually arched
tube ends not squared off where seat and chain stays join to rear dropout
no markings on dropouts
seat post binder is not in the place usually seen on 90's Scapins, or nearly as elegant
no Scapin panto on the BB
no serial no. on the BB
I've not seen a 1990's Scapin with a single bottle cage

just doesn't quite add up and looks different to the bikes in period catalogues although it has a classic 90's Scapin paint job (which I rather like)

P

 

[jim haseltine]

I saw a couple guys of frames like that with different paint jobs and decals at a cafe stop on a Sunday club rub in Italy (to be clear, they were on the club run, I was on holiday with SHEWHOMUSTBEOBEYED) - the Columbus 'squadra corse' sticker rang bells and the lugless construction together with the unicrown forks and that particular seat bolt collar looked familiar too. I suspect that they're a middling spec generic frame marketed to smaller companies for badge engineering so that their staff can concentrate on building their high-end frames.
One of the bikes I saw was badged for an Italian company I'd never heard of (not difficult really, how many Italians will have heard of Bob Jackson or Woodrup?) and another carried MBK stickers. Both could have been resprays or rebadged - I certainly used to race on frames rebadged for the shop I worked in.

 

[petewo]

thanks
that sounds like a pretty likely explanation
Low/mid spec is not per se that important. It's reasonably light for steel, fits well, rides nicely and I'm going to enjoy it.
P

 

[otherself]

Is bottom bracket Italian thread?

 

[petewo]

yes, Italian thread BB.
Unusual BB shell though, the outer 1cm on both sides has a smaller circumference than the centre section, I've not seen a BB shell like it before

 

[otherself]

yes, Italian thread BB.

Likely it is Italian made frame then. Frame is probably columbus genius or max.

 

[one-eyed_jim]

It's interesting that the front triangle is TIG welded while the stays are brazed on. The bottom bracket shell is unusual, but I don't recall seeing another one like it.

Definitely NOT Columbus MAX: MAX had very recognisable tapered bi-ovalised tubes.

 

[petewo]

thanks for the ongoing input
I have done some rudimentary tube diameter measurements and the dimensions fit descriptions of Columbus Thron oversized tubing, the tubes are all round except the (somewhat slab-sided near the BB) ovalised chain stays, however 27.0 seatpost a bit suprising, and it's not just an overtightened 27.2, although I very much hoped it would be
Of course it may not be Columbus tubing at all..