Ali. The Greatest.

[konatime]

A name used by slave owners or the name of slave owners.....would someone have been in default had they used the transitory name of Cassius x he was once happy enough to tout.

There is context to remarks that Cassius x made, Terrell had known him from being shortpants (not too sure they might have been taught at the same school) and the name cassius would certainly have had greater longevity to ernie than Muhammad....running his eyes down the ropes cause he wont use a name he insists on dont exactly sound like Bertie the Buddist does it? Did'nt Malcolm x himself remark how Clay had gotten himself into some divine state were he actually thought he was all that.

Frazier did'nt agree about times being different back then, did'nt agree at all, held onto those remarks for 25yrs so deeply burnt was he after helping cassius financially whilst he was in isolation....they made up after clay apologised decades later...frazier was right about one thing..'man got humble when he was ill, not before'.

 

[Adruzzz]

Re: Re:

What is the issue with the name Ali chose?

There is context to all the remarks he made about opponents, it was a different time.

What is in no doubt right now is that continuing to refer to him by a name used by slave owners is a deliberate refusal to acknowledge a man's right to escape oppression and define himself.

I am sure there is a shortcut for that, but I won't play those games.

Sadly, I think you're wasting your breath mate, ignorance is never a pretty sight

 

[konatime]

Re: Re:

What is the issue with the name Ali chose?

There is context to all the remarks he made about opponents, it was a different time.

What is in no doubt right now is that continuing to refer to him by a name used by slave owners is a deliberate refusal to acknowledge a man's right to escape oppression and define himself.

I am sure there is a shortcut for that, but I won't play those games.

Sadly, I think you're wasting your breath mate, ignorance is never a pretty sight

yow can say that ^ again

'An eternal legend who if you were black and believed in Jesus, would call you to your face an "Uncle Tom Nigger." I was a bicycle messenger in NYC in the '80's. Came out of a building on seventh avenue and saw a crowd across the street. So I went to see what was going on. It was the "champ" and he was passing out pamphlets on Islam saying Islam was the way. He attempted to hand me one, but when I saw it I said "Islam is not the way, Jesus is the Way!" The fight was on. Ali started doing all that stuff you see on the old tapes trying to intimidate me. But by the grace of God, I held firm and let him know I didn't agree with his religious position. And that was when He let me know (a fellow black man) how he thought about me who believed on Jesus, by using the greatest slur one black can impose on another'

 

[highlandsflyer]

If you need to resort to lifting material without even crediting it you really have lost the argument.

Who ever suggested Ali was perfect?

It is, however, 2016, and in the here and now he is a hero to billions.

My view is he, like Nelson Mandela, earned his place.

Some people on the right still choose to refer to Mandela as a terrorist.

It seems some other people choose to continue using what is considered a damning slur to refer to Ali.

Then justify themselves with spurious references to ancient news, and random anonymous internet derived quotes.

One being beyond the statute of limitations, the other being hearsay.

Neither a compelling argument for the continued use of the slur.

Left with a simple conclusion. Not a lazy conclusion.

Yet who brought the subject of racism into the story?

Often it is that the guilty wish to make note of their crime.

 

[widowmaker]

Re:

As a boxer, without doubt the greatest.

As a person the arguments will rage on.

I am a boxing fan, whereas I don't like people

 

[konatime]

If you need to resort to lifting material without even crediting it you really have lost the argument.

Who ever suggested Ali was perfect?

It is, however, 2016, and in the here and now he is a hero to billions.

My view is he, like Nelson Mandela, earned his place.

Some people on the right still choose to refer to Mandela as a terrorist.

It seems some other people choose to continue using what is considered a damning slur to refer to Ali.

Then justify themselves with spurious references to ancient news, and random anonymous internet derived quotes.

One being beyond the statute of limitations, the other being hearsay.

Neither a compelling argument for the continued use of the slur.

Left with a simple conclusion. Not a lazy conclusion.

Yet who brought the subject of racism into the story?

Often it is that the guilty wish to make note of their crime.

It's perhaps enlightening that Joe Frazier did'nt call Ali 'Cassius x' to warrant him getting called an uncle tom...the common denominator seems to be uncle tom...you're right about the guilty wishing to make note of thier crimes..Clays mob were'nt just Muslim....they were black muslim. Foreman who was well embroiled in all the black power movement of the time expands on the feeling of power and the preaching of the white man being the devil, both Clays first & 2nd wifes back this up independently and explain in the nicest way possible that clay was'nt actually the smartest of kids with a mental age far below his years..he managed to alienate Frazier so much that Joe (can i call him that) said even after clay apologised that he somehow enjoyed him being ill after the misery he had brought to his door...'wow' (after he campaigned to Nixon on Clays behalf to get his license returned, Frazier of course had met real poverty in his life...unlike the middle class cassius and he felt it very unjust to remove 'Ali's' means of getting a $) Patterson did'nt agree with the Islam shout from Clay, knowing full well how he was being manipulated...guess what...'uncle Tom Ni**er'

That said ^ the kid could box, a lot of the moves were martial art oriented down no doubt from Archie Moore who was taught them by a '40's black coach who's name escapes me...enjoy...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

 

[konatime]

Re:

Can you imagine if you was an happy clapper and you discovered 'Cassius' the name was fine and dandy if there were no camera's around (no easy brotherhood pr)....you'd get to thinking the seen and the unseen were'nt the same barra.

 

[konatime]

Re:

The Brotherhood looked like they cared more about giving him a new name than they did about walking him into the ring to face larry holmes...seems to me the white man Freddie Pacheco cared more for Ali than they did....does anybody know what financial cut they made out of taking the lamb to the slaughter. Twats trick.

 

[dyna-ti]

Lifelong hero, I would imagine for many. A beautiful man. At peace.

So sad that he had to spend so much time fighting prejudice. And hypocritical that some of those applauding his life and success, were the ones prejudicing him because of his skin tone.
Showed them all for sure.

 

[konatime]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9O_9ANas7NQ ....his book is a fascinating read