26” Endurance Ride Cunningdale build.

[Woz]

Mmmh. The SM800 w/ Pepperoni forks. I had one once for short while till it was stolen.

It certainly ticked the box of power going to the back wheel. Not a bad choice. The BB is indeed high. You will be able to pedal around every corner......so no excuse for freewheeling......slap on a good 48T or 50T big ring. That alone may be a interesting scenario if you are in a group of roadies. Either way, push your aero limits to the max though.

 

[The History Man]

With you on the higher bars.

 

[Frankenorange]

Wise words. Drops need to be comfortable and usable - anything else is just fashion. Most road riders (non-racing) also have drops too low in my view. What suits a 20-something Pro who rides 50,000km per year (and who is paid to be in pain) is not right for the rest of us.

"My back just hurts looking at that, mate". A forum favourite!

Good posture, core strength, and stretching cost nothing but time and a little effort. Not that much time and effort in the great scheme of things is required to maintain flexibilty, even in later years.

If people are in pain riding their slammed stem then that is plain stoopid, and i have no sympathy, but the same could be said for rising the bars an inch for each decade once one is north of 30, just because. In a way that is also "fashion" and LD stems are absolutely 100% fashion if there is no actual need to have bars at that height and it is for looks only. Fair enough if one is building a museum piece, or a true copy of something famous, but for reall world riding.....not for me....and dirt drop bars that don't give a comfortable position on the hoods.....again, not for me.

The whole point,in my mind, of different shaped bars is making more hand positions available and they should all be safe and comfortable. Dirt drop bars don't actually tick that many boxes unless you only want to be in the drops or climb hands either side of the stem. Of course; if it suits the owner then rule 1 applies and to hell with anothers opinion. Same goes for slammed.

Anyway....It might feel more comfortable, to have higher bars, but it may also be a sign that the office job is not doing you any good, or too many pies and not enough stomach muscle is changing the angle of the pelvis and the lumbar is caving in etc. These things will cause alot more problems, in all aspects of life, if they go untreated so really we should all be aiming to be fit and able to ride in the 'pro position' and then choose, individually, if we want to look over the hedgrows, at the sheep and cows, or grind away and chew the handlebars. Having the choice should be the goal. Being physically able should be the goal.

Obviously; an injury/deformity/illness is going to be the limiting factor, for some, but in my experience there are way more people who can't get their nose to their knees and fingers to toes, when they really should be able to, and they do not have those limiting factors.

I am not a doctor and don't start doing 100 situps. Actually do anything else other than the situps you were taught, at school, circa 1977!

 

[pw_pw_la]

Wait, what’s wrong with sit-ups? I like sit-ups!

Pies, too.

 

[Frankenorange]

Wait, what’s wrong with sit-ups? I like sit-ups!

Pies, too.

Nowt wrong with pies and i would fight to the death for a good pie. Still peeved there was low mince pie availability in this house, over xmas. It is the rubber content, in pies, that manifests itself around my middle that is the problem

Good ol' fashioned sit ups aren't good for the lower back. I think it is a good way to fire a disc out. I believe the armed forces, in the USA, banned them in pt a year or so ago, because of the risks, for example. Pretty sure they aren't encoraged in UK schools these days, either. I may he wrong about this tho.

Actually; i am not sure a great deal is actually encouraged in UK schools, these days!

 

[doctor-bond]

Nice. With the tall fronts, those Pioneer frames are ideal for dirt drops. I think the key point of such bars is the flare to allow a natural hand position and good control off road: didn’t the early Cunninghams use stock road bars bent outward to achieve this? Then you need to get the bar high so the flare is at the right level for most use; hence the LD stem as a practical solution.

The contraption I’m building is all sorts of contrary: an offroader trying to be a road bike but still with off road styling: so in that sense it is just “fashion” or perverse style. But it will offer plenty of hand positions to break the monotony.

I’d also agree that fitness and suppleness will be the master key to this - along with fuel.

I’ve almost got the MK1 built, and it already seems to be breaking the bar-at-saddle-height rule, so we’ll see how that goes. I’ll take it on a set course and Strava it so I can do performance comparisons alongside subjective feel. I’m expecting gearing will also take some faffing with (Sheldon’s gear calculator floats before my dream-addled eyes….)

 

[doctor-bond]

So, MK1 built and taken for a quick shakedown ride.



First impressions?

1. “He’s an ugly little spud isnt he?”
2. It fits! The bar is is a little lower than I’d normally have for off road, but it’s higher than my road bike. Feels good so far; will need a proper ride to be sure.
3. It weighs in at 22.6 lbs at the mo. Not really light enough. I can diet the wheels, tyres, tensioner, BB, rear canti, and loose a redundant shifter. That should get it nearer a 20lb fighting weight.
4. Shifter on the inner bar will have to move as it’s a bit awkward for the extended ride planned. Will move it to the stem.
5. It flies and handles: again, will need to see what a day ride does to this impression, and whether the high BB really makes any difference (as noted, one of the oddities of this BotE geometry is a long wheelbase).
6. Gearing: currently 26, 36, 48 X 19. Too low. Middle ring spins out pretty quickly. Trial and error will be key, but I think the middle ring needs to sustain a comfortable 15mph and be capable of false flats and headwind flats?
7. Did I mention how it looks? will prolly have to get a bigger frame.

Hoping to get out a bit further tomorrow, but it’s 50mph gusts hereabouts at the mo ….. 🌬

 

[Frankenorange]

So, MK1 built and taken for a quick shakedown ride.

View attachment 599319

First impressions?

1. “He’s an ugly little spud isnt he?”
2. It fits! The bar is is a little lower than I’d normally have for off road, but it’s higher than my road bike. Feels good so far; will need a proper ride to be sure.
3. It weighs in at 22.6 lbs at the mo. Not really light enough. I can diet the wheels, tyres, tensioner, BB, rear canti, and loose a redundant shifter. That should get it nearer a 20lb fighting weight.
4. Shifter on the inner bar will have to move as it’s a bit awkward for the extended ride planned. Will move it to the stem.
5. It flies and handles: again, will need to see what a day ride does to this impression, and whether the high BB really makes any difference (as noted, one of the oddities of this BotE geometry is a long wheelbase).
6. Gearing: currently 26, 36, 48 X 19. Too low. Middle ring spins out pretty quickly. Trial and error will be key, but I think the middle ring needs to sustain a comfortable 15mph and be capable of false flats and headwind flats?
7. Did I mention how it looks? will prolly have to get a bigger frame.

Hoping to get out a bit further tomorrow, but it’s 50mph gusts hereabouts at the mo ….. 🌬

Nice going with the weight and agree regarding gearing. I target 15mph as an average for mostly hilly dorset lanes with the odd bridleway/byway/white lane link. On my own with large off-road tyres(i am on 2.2 folding Race Kings(not race sport spec) it is hard work to achieve. i think aero starts really coming into play at 14mph, and from there it just gets harder, but I have gears to play with. Give a 17t a go with your middle ring, i reckon.

I use this website for gearing http://ritzelrechner.de/ as it is fun to use, seems to be very accurate, and you can compare some different setups.

Not sure where you are but there were flippin' strong SW winds in north Dorset, today. Same winds tmrw but not as strong as Storm Malik will have passed. There were some very strong winds and i am pretty sure Shetland lost both trees. Looks like there is another storm inbound but Northern Ireland getting it first.

 

[Woz]

Some easy and inexpensive lard reduction:
- loose the granny ring and the 5 bolts
- check some of the lightweight Schwalbe inner-tubes, about 100 grams for 26"
- replace the QRs for allen key style

 

[Woz]

Oh forgot. It's ugly, but who cares. Rear cassette may be a bit too close ratio? Something like 11-28 with a SS cage road mech may be better.