1960s Sun Snipe Prestige

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Just bought this at the weekend. I realised after researching what I'd bought that it was also listed here. Hoping for some help with the restoration - this is my first proper vintage bike. I have a Kalkhoff road bike that'd already been built up into a budget gravel when I bought it, but otherwise new to this.

Re-using the before pics from @neil__j's for-sale thread because I can't beat them.

 

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Re: 1960s Sun Snipe Prestige - restoration help!

More pics - and current status. This was owned from new, ridden for a decade or three, then kept in the garage for a decade or three.

Yesterday: All of the moving parts work - can get through all of the gears, although haven't tried properly to get through one at a time yet. The brakes do slow the bike down.

The bottom bracket has a 'grease nipple', so I chucked some grease in there yesterday, pumped up the tires, and went a couple of hundred metres around the block, it rides nicely and is a good fit for me.

 

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Re: 1960s Sun Snipe Prestige - restoration help!

So the bike is as far as I know 99% original except for the tires (and the extremely brutalist and corroded kick stand, which is now removed and in a box in the shed).

Planning to keep it as original as possible, then figure out what the definition of 'possible' is once it's more properly rideable. I am a bit sceptical about the steel rims, but this won't get ridden in the pouring rain (at least not on purpose), and also a bit sceptical about the plastic simplex derailleur. But the wheels seem pretty essentially OK, and the derailleur does shift.

If I do end up replacing the derailleur, how strict are people with authenticity - i.e. is any '60s or '70s claw derailleur OK?

Have some SCHWALBE Classics HS 159 coming in the post, and also some fibrax raincheaters for the steel rims (about 1/4 the price of koolstop salmons).

The cotter pins are very rusted, and the BB is surprisingly smooth as far as I can tell and potentially can be tightened from the non-drive side (at least it look possible). So thinking I'm better off leaving the pins where they are until there's a genuine problem to fix - on the basis that if I strip them down the cranks might not go back together again anyway so why do that before replacing the crankset? But opinions welcome. Also if I do end up replacing the crankset is it sacrilege to switch to (vintage) square taper?

So for now planning to clean up as much as possible in place - soaked most of the accessible bolts, and wrapped a few bits in white vinegar-soaked kitchen towel.

Don't have spare brake and gear cables handy, so waiting on those to clean up the derailleur and brakes properly.

First question - the surface rust comes off easily enough with white vinegar and some steel wool, but there's quite a lot of pitting. What do you lot do about the pitting? I can keep chucking GT85 at it and maybe some acrylic/lacquer but are there other options?

The frame itself is in good nick, with a few scratches and rust areas all less then 5mm across - is there anything to do apart from try to carefully remove the rust without making the spots bigger and oil it up?

Built in before/after with the pedals each side, since I did one at a time while looking at other stuff... Excuse the crap photo, weather was ropey and you can see why I borrowed the ones from the listing.

 

[biggs682]

That is very nice and original

 

[catch]

Thanks it is lovely and I can't wait to ride it more than 200 metres.

To me the plastic-y handlebar tape looks '70s rather than '60s, also pretty sure that gap in the wrapping is responsible for the rust on the clamp.

Thinking of going for (orange or yellow) cloth and shellac bar tape instead... (after getting the pedals regreased and the brakes themselves cleaned up).

Managed to get a lot of the surface rust off the rims, plenty of pits though and still not sure what to do about those - will something like evaporust (or the jenorite or hammerite equivalents) get into the pits better than white vinegar/foil and water?

Or use a rust converter, but sounds like those turn black/blue which is going to be visually even worse than the pits. Although maybe not so bad if I can get them as clean as possible beforehand, then it's more of a precaution for anything left in there.

I inspected the frame a bit closer, and the odd paint chips don't seem to have any surface rust as far as I can tell, so thinking the undercoat/primer is working. So now thinking the best thing to do is to just give it a once-over with an oily rag occasionally unless any actual problems crop up.

 

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Bit more progress. Rear rack and mudguards are off for now.

Stripped the brakes all the way down to give them a clean, redid the cables and housing, fitted some fibrax raincheater pads for the steel rims and tightened a couple of loose spokes. Stops pretty well now and took it out down a (gentle) hill. Going to clip the brake cables a bit more. Also that outer housing doesn't look like it did online, might look for some plain yellow or brown instead.

The drive side pedal spins very freely, and the left pedal span not very well at all. The left pedal just had dried gunk in it, the right pedal had some still-wet grease but not much.

Stripped both all the way down and back up with new bearings - 5/32" so had to get a headset pack from the LBS (and a 16mm cone spanner because nothing else would fit, a week's worth of plusgas meant they just slipped off in the end though).

Built them back up, and the right pedal is still spinning very freely, and the left pedal still not so much.

It's a very fine line on the left side between resistance and play, so thinking of tightening the right side up a bit more so they match, then see if they loosen slightly with use. Advice welcome - I know new pedals are variable on how much they spin, but no idea what these old Williams ones were supposed to be like in the first place.

 

[allenh]

Nice thing that, I do like the Sun's from around that period.

I did one of these a few years ago although mine I think was a little later at around 1965/66 and its surprising how different some of the components were and I suspect some of mine had been upgraded over the years as I doubt it would have had the Maxy cotterless crank from new. I did upgrade some of the bits as I went along in that I re-laced the wheels with alloy rims and replaced the saddle and seat stem with an alloy one but apart from that after the re paint and polish mine was as I got it.

There is another in exactly the same paint scheme as mine for sale locally although again quite different to both of ours component wise.

I've also got another that is pre Raleigh so a proper Birmingham Sun and I must get round to doing that one.

 

[Old Ned]

Nice buy. However, I'd go easy on that Prestige rear mech. It's on of the early 'all-plastic' ones and they had a habit of snapping in half even when new if the rider was powerful. Mine snapped when sprinting for the Slough sign in late '67 and I'd had it for a couple of years then. Simplex added some steel side plates to the main arms not long after. When they forst came out they were half the price of the Campagnolo Gran Sport (and probably also half the weight) and worked very well. I see you have a metal gear lever. The original one sold with the mech was also plastic, squeaked when wet - and broke without to much effort!

 

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Nice buy. However, I'd go easy on that Prestige rear mech. It's on of the early 'all-plastic' ones and they had a habit of snapping in half even when new if the rider was powerful. Mine snapped when sprinting for the Slough sign in late '67 and I'd had it for a couple of years then.

Oof!

I read up about these but good to hear about this problem first hand. Have picked up a Suntour VX GT to fit instead, this is in the next couple of things to do. The Suntour is about 15 years younger than the bike (although about the same age as me), but figured it's what someone would have bought if theirs snapped a few years later than yours did.

 

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Re:

Had some trouble swapping the derailleur (chain kept jumping off the front ring, even on the stand). After a trip to the LBS turns out the chainring was bent and it's now straightened up and got a Suntour VX shortcage on.


I was going to take the bar tape off and cotton + shellac it, but the LBS reckons it's the actual original bar tape, so would feel guilty doing that since it's completely usable at the moment.

Raining most of yesterday but hopefully get it out for a few miles today.